The Definitive Bluesbreaker Speaker Thread...

[908ssp]

I'll be perfectly honest. When I think Bluesbreaker I think Beano that is the tone in my head. I got the idea years ago that there were silver alnicos in his amp so I set out looking for some. I paid a lot more for the two original ones I have than the Scumnicos. When I started my BB project the Scumnicos didn't exist yet so looking for the real thing was my only option. Seeing how over board I went with the amp I am not unhappy with spending the money but I would have to really think twice about it now. If you want a different sound than the Beano album say an AC/DC sound than pick a different speaker.

Lots of guys here swap caps and resistors around like popcorn well I don't do that I swap speakers. I have owned a ton of them and still own way too many. It is well known that speakers make the biggest difference in the final sound than any single piece maybe more that the guitar.

[Brad737]

No, the Beano tone is EXACTLY what I'm after. I don't mind paying more to get the right sound. But I was thinking if I could get the same sound with Webers or something else, it would be stupid to blow an extra $110. But if the Scumnicos are going to give me the exact tone I want, I'll probably pick up a pair.

Thanks,
Brad

[shakti]

This thread gets my highest seal of approval. Lots of excellent info here!

[yngwie308]

http://www.legendarytones.com/claptonearly1.html

yngwie308

[Brad737]

Cool article. Thanks.

Brad

[neikeel]

Brad- The few KT66 Bluesbreakers I've seen from 1965-66 over the years including one Park version were all like that, i.e., two 16 ohm speakers in parallel, inc one with orig alnico G12s and the rest w/G12M20s.

Of the alnicos: All the T530s I've seen w/orig cones had H1777. Like Jim said, T1088s from 1964 had H1777, but in mid/late '65 102 003 started appearing.

However, Marshall didn't use T530s, which were just for VOX, or T1088s or T1656 alnicos, they generally used T652 15 ohm alnicos for G12. T652 at least started out identical to T530, except for color, no bell cover, label, and 15 ohm VC instead of 8.

And T731 was identical to T652 except for color, usually found in Selmers.

I don't recall if I've seen original cone in '65 T652 from a Marshall, as opposed to '64 which definitely had H1777, but maybe someone reading this has some.

I did recall that Don Butler has a pair of T731s w/same date codes from 6/65, and he was good enough to confirm the original cone codes: H1777 in one and 102 003 in the other!

I am a bit cross with myself as I sold a bunch of Alnicos earlier this year to fund buying a couple of golds (I needed the power handling).

One was a T731 with 1963 code on original card gasket and a RIC1 cone code. I sold two silvers (T1088) with 102 003 cone codes from 68 (I blew one and had it reconed by Wembley Speakers - highly recommended), an original coned '62 blue and a new blue RI.

They sounded great but I have a 1987 spec amp in my Mojo 2x12 combo cab and needed more power capacity, having blown one I did not want to repeat the exercise .

Having said that I have put a pair of G12H 55s in for the moment as I have been switching (ABY) between my '64 AC30T with blues and wanted a contrast. Wired 16ohms each in parallel. They are pretty loud and articulate but do not have the sweetness of Alnicos and I miss the bottom end you get with a straight 4x12.

Ultimate plan is to gig small venues with just the Bluesbreaker almost as a backline 'monitor' plus PA and I reckon the Golds will be put in for keeps.

[Jeff West]

Thanks for more info here, Neil. Yeah, the RICs are also original and seem to turn up, esp early in '60s then again in 1970s.

Did you find the '68 1088s tended to sound different than the early '60s versions?

The RI blues are good but I never thought they sound exactly like a '63 blue.

How do you find the golds compare to everything else?

[paulster]

Alex

What power handling are the Scumnicos you've been trying?

They sound really promising.

Cheers
Paul

[Scumback Speakers]

The one I sent to Alex was the 30 watt 8 ohm to match his 67 Vox Silver more closely.

[novosibir]

Larry says "Ok, the concrete description of the speakers is Celestion Alnico Silver T.652

The type of speaker, Eric Clapton had mounted in his Bluesbreaker Amp, used on the Beano Album." I assume he got this info from Udo Pipper aka PepperN. see http://forum.metroamp.com/viewtopic.php?p=149352#149352

Yes, that's correct!

And Udo still told me, that he has compared the orig. Celestion Alnico Silver, mounted in the old cab seen on his video to exactly the same speakers (he owns 6 of these), but mounted into a Mojo Bluesbreaker cab with the same size - and the cabs, loaded with the same speakers, sounded way different!

The old cab sounded tight, woody and chunky, the Mojo cab also sounded not bad, but looser in the lows, 'slower' and not so "dry".

Larry

[novosibir]

Lots of guys here swap caps and resistors around like popcorn well I don't do that I swap speakers. I have owned a ton of them and still own way too many. It is well known that speakers make the biggest difference in the final sound than any single piece maybe more that the guitar.

I (nearly) agree!

The most differences soundwise IMO make different guitars, different speakers & different output transformers, about in this order. Remarkable later then first come the differences, caused by different tube brands and different component brands.

Larry

[Brad737]

Thought I'd resurrect this thread. I FINALLY got a JTM45. The JTM definitely sounds darker than my Super Lead. I've only plugged her into a Greenback-loaded 412 and a 212 with Celestion Blues. Neither really got me all that close to the Beano sound, although it sounded really good through the Greenbacks. I didn't really care for the JTM through the Blues to be perfectly honest. I have a couple other cabinets I'll plug into when I have some more time. Are the Scumnicos still the preferred Beano speakers?
Thanks,
Brad

[Roe]

Thought I'd resurrect this thread. I FINALLY got a JTM45. The JTM definitely sounds darker than my Super Lead. I've only plugged her into a Greenback-loaded 412 and a 212 with Celestion Blues. Neither really got me all that close to the Beano sound, although it sounded really good through the Greenbacks. I didn't really care for the JTM through the Blues to be perfectly honest. I have a couple other cabinets I'll plug into when I have some more time. Are the Scumnicos still the preferred Beano speakers?
Thanks,
Brad

yes, until the scumnico PVCs arrive!

[Brad737]

Haven't heard of the PVCs. What's the deal with those?

[Roe]

paper voice coils like celestion used in the mid 60s