Dummy Loads

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 12:04 pm

908ssp wrote:There are only handful in the states so you aren't going to find many people with them yet. There are no tone controls or preselects on the Richter just one volume knob.

I had a friend and professional guitarist recording engineer over tonight we tested the Richter on a number of amps and against the Ultimate and the Alessandro to be blunt there is no contest. The Richter is hands down better. It is simply so transparent it is uncanny. There is no change in eq curve until the volume is below talking level. There is no grainy fizzy rough no change in distortion just as smooth quite as it is loud. I need to sell my Ultimate, Alessandro and Weber so I can buy another one so forget you read this.

so how does it compare to the weber or thd?

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 12:12 pm

I think the Weber is much better then the THD or Allessandro but really all three of those are pretty similar sounding. The webers a bit different but it still has similar limitations. If it kills the Allessandro it probably is much better then those as well. It would be nice to try the rtichter. Whats the website again? I dont know if Ill try one ever but its tempting. The Weber is a reactive load as well.

bmf5150 · Post by **bmf5150** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 12:16 pm

how is the new weber?i hear it has low mid and high mid adjustments.can you get pretty good low vol with it?

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 12:30 pm

Its the best 'Attenuator' Ive owned. But it still has the attenuator problems.

Bainzy · Post by **Bainzy** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 7:42 pm

Are attenuators really worth the high prices you pay for them in the UK in terms of cost to produce them? I've seen JCM800's go for cheaper than a lot of these attenuators cost (possibly even cheaper than a THD hotplate).

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Sun Jan 15, 2006 1:15 pm

Ill put it this way. You are totally able to get your 100W marshalls volume down to match the drums without any serious tone alteration. Pretty clear. But as you pass stage volume going lower, they really start to sound worse and worse. They are also good just as a load when working on your amp or taking a line level out to DI or poweramps.

You have the Richter over there. The user 908/Alex recently got one and says it to be much better then a THD or ALlesandro and on par with a UA at low levels. Thats impressive. Its about 400US here but I think its what 250UK? May be worth checking out.

DELANEY · Post by **DELANEY** » Fri Jan 20, 2006 2:44 pm

I built my attenuator for 25 bucks. It has three 16 Ohm 35 watt sprauge resistors, and a 100 Watt 8 Ohm L-Pad. It works. I don't know why, I get decent results. I knew that my JTM45 would throw out around 50 watts, so I figured in a little more wattage.

I don't know why I would pay 300 bucks for an attenuator. Because someone says that it is not following the math?

hmmmmm... I trust my ears.

bmf5150 · Post by **bmf5150** » Fri Jan 20, 2006 10:14 pm

DELANEY wrote:I built my attenuator for 25 bucks. It has three 16 Ohm 35 watt sprauge resistors, and a 100 Watt 8 Ohm L-Pad. It works. I don't know why, I get decent results. I knew that my JTM45 would throw out around 50 watts, so I figured in a little more wattage.

I don't know why I would pay 300 bucks for an attenuator. Because someone says that it is not following the math?

hmmmmm... I trust my ears.

post a schematic!

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Sat Jan 21, 2006 2:05 am

DELANEY wrote:Because someone says that it is not following the math?

I dont understand what you mean here? If I thought I could make one better then the webber I would. I would love to. The MASS 150 is great as far as attenuators go but it isnt exactly music to my ears. Any attenuator is goof with me for cutting down the stage volume a bit but at home Id rather take a load line out to a small poweramp. I wish something did a good job at high attenuation levels.

bmf5150 · Post by **bmf5150** » Sat Jan 21, 2006 10:25 am

" wish something did a good job at high attenuation levels."you and me both!!!

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Sat Jan 21, 2006 10:48 pm

Billy Batz wrote:
DELANEY wrote:Because someone says that it is not following the math?
I dont understand what you mean here? If I thought I could make one better then the webber I would. I would love to. The MASS 150 is great as far as attenuators go but it isnt exactly music to my ears. Any attenuator is goof with me for cutting down the stage volume a bit but at home Id rather take a load line out to a small poweramp. I wish something did a good job at high attenuation levels.

I'm sorry I just don't have an expensive attenuator to compare with. I really don't understand what you guys say is so missing in the expensive units you buy."Isn't exactly music to my ears" sounds like an uncontestable subjection.

All I meant was, sure, you won't get a resistive load like my attenuator to push back like a reative load. It won't "respond" like a reactive load. But what the hell does that mean? Does it sound different? -nope- Does it play different -nope-

IMHO, sometimes this engineering stuff gets too over the top for me, where the engineering has little value to the emperical example... You Know, too much thinking, not enough listening and playing... all brains no penis...

Well I play my guitar and it sounds like all I need. I'm trying to have fun here

I know the human ear has different response curve as well... so I try to have realistic expectations.

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Sat Jan 21, 2006 11:46 pm

Anonymous wrote: I'm sorry I just don't have an expensive attenuator to compare with. I really don't understand what you guys say is so missing in the expensive units you buy."Isn't exactly music to my ears" sounds like an uncontestable subjection.

I thought I was pretty clear. It works but it doesnt sound so great at low volumes. For what I was posting I wasnt trying to be more specific. They are what they are Im not expecting to get true cranked tone at -20dbs. But some DO sound better for some people then others. Ive had others and the MASS150 works for me for what Im willing to pay for attenaution.

Anonymous wrote:IMHO, sometimes this engineering stuff gets too over the top for me, where the engineering has little value to the emperical example... You Know, too much thinking, not enough listening and playing... all brains no penis...

Im with you. I really am. I feel the same way but that attitude is all too aristocratic as well. Theres no engineers here. I dont know the difference between resistive and reactive and I only allude to the fact that to the engineers reactive sounds more like the unattenuated amp. Its also new and may be good and the one unit has gotten a good review by someone in this thread in a direct comparison. Sounds promising but I have no problem admitting right now what you were clearly implying. Its easier to talk about gear then learn to be a good player of which I know I am not.

rockstah · Post by **rockstah** » Sun Jan 22, 2006 2:43 am

hey Stan,

you mentioned you have original transformers, drakes i think you said in your amp.
did you have the heyboer drake clones, OT and PT that george has in the store to compare to your originals?
if so was it night and day or were they pretty close to your original drakes?
Mark

DELANEY · Post by **DELANEY** » Sun Jan 22, 2006 11:04 am

That's cool Dan, I think we're on the same page.

Furthermore, I think it's odd that people fuss about attenuators slightly sounding "different" than a non attenuated amp, when Marshall owners throw all kinds of expertly modded boost pedal(s) proir to the amplifier which BTW, definately screws with the response and tone.

If you mismatch your impedance, you can hear a definate voicing difference and response, even without an attenuator.

Even though I think attenuator use is mandatory for my playing because I just don't play in stadiums, I refrain from overly suggesting them on the PP board. Here, people build amps; there, some people are scary and I think even cabling a device in between the amp and speaker and validating the impedance, is a chore. Usually they have paid over $1500 for the amp itself, and don't know what makes them tick. So diming them might see component failure and I don't want to be the guy saying "yeah do it, you'll sound like Eddie, but sorry your amp smoked..."

Sorry for being seeming arrogant, I sincerely just want to present my point confidently... not cause I feel my way is some predestined light of the ages. If its any consellation, I do enjoy the "Beef it's what's for dinner" interlude, for that matter all upbeat Oklahoma type string arrangments...

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Sun Jan 22, 2006 11:28 am

lol. Actually you would think at a site filled with people who all build their own 100W amps people would be frying things left and right. But since ive been posting here that is a pretty rare case. Only a few fried trannys with everyone otherwise cranking their amps to ten with no problems.

Im totally a purist. I dont like anything in front of the amp accept my fuzz and the occassional Treble Boost or wah of coarse. Most of the time just strait. So attenuation methods are basically my main concern for my sound assuming everything else is nailed down. I think most people here are probably liek that. Especially the evh guys who probably have nothing before the amp and want to crank everything on 10 as well.

Its not even that they soudn different. Of coarse they will. I dont mind as long as its still good but at low levels the production units Ive tried sound really bad. SO I had the Powerbrake. Worked but sounded really bad at low levels. Then the THD. Worked, sounded better at lower levels but still not so great. Then MASS. Woked, sounded even better but still not great at the lowest levels. I know the UA is best for low levels because taking the line out from my MASS as load to a SS poweramp is the best low volume sound I can get. But $400+50 for each mod, 2 of which are necessities! God.............Damn!