Van Halen Reverb

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rgalpin
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Re: Van Halen Reverb

Post by rgalpin » Thu May 13, 2010 10:17 am

Dig wrote:What I want to know is how close can I come to getting this type of re-amped delayed-reverb, spacious sound for live application? ...and, of course, HOW?
a little bit off-topic - sorry - but i wanted to chime in on the answer to Dig's question about a LIVE RIG and that i don't think it has anything to do with re-amping, slaving, or reverb LIVE.

just 2 amps into separate cabs, one dry, and one wet with a quick slap that is slightly modulating. simple recipe. tastes goot.

for your slap, find a delay that has some modulation control to it - or simulated tape warble - and make it so that it is just slightly modulating in and out of tune in a slow sweep. i use a cheap-o digitech stomp box with a "tape sim" setting.

you won't need or want any verb in a live rig once you hear what this setup can do. it adds depth and detailed character to everything you do. you could just drop the guitar on the ground and it will sound cool.

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Re: Van Halen Reverb

Post by Dig » Thu May 13, 2010 11:29 pm

rgalpin wrote:a little bit off-topic - sorry - but i wanted to chime in on the answer to Dig's question about a LIVE RIG and that i don't think it has anything to do with re-amping, slaving, or reverb LIVE.

just 2 amps into separate cabs, one dry, and one wet with a quick slap that is slightly modulating. simple recipe. tastes goot.

for your slap, find a delay that has some modulation control to it - or simulated tape warble - and make it so that it is just slightly modulating in and out of tune in a slow sweep. i use a cheap-o digitech stomp box with a "tape sim" setting.

you won't need or want any verb in a live rig once you hear what this setup can do. it adds depth and detailed character to everything you do. you could just drop the guitar on the ground and it will sound cool.
I think someone did an entire album of dropping the guitar on various surfaces for some killer songs using the setup you described. :lol: No, but seriously; that sounds like yet another great idea, and I will definitely try it. The only reason I would hesitate right now is because I'm not too fond of my #2 amp's tone. I do actually have a good Tonebone A/B/Y pedal for the whole dual amp recipe. I think I'd have to invest in another amp or, at least another cab (which is something I'm not prepared to do right now) to get a comparable tone from both amps. On the other hand, I nearly have all the ingredients for the "re-amping" method without spending more money.

I'll try everything I can until it sounds how I want it to sound. I'm glad I posted to this thread. I've gotten a ton of great suggestions and advise! Thanks to everyone who's chimed in so far. Keep it coming. :!:

I'll be sure to report back and update the thread once I've experimented with all these ideas everyone's shared here.

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Re: Van Halen Reverb

Post by rgalpin » Fri May 14, 2010 4:11 pm

Dig wrote: I think someone did an entire album of dropping the guitar on various surfaces for some killer songs using the setup you described. :lol:
yeah... i think that was POISON. ;)

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Re: Van Halen Reverb

Post by rgalpin » Tue May 18, 2010 9:33 am

hey guys - i posted a clip of a test using dirtycooters config from this thread - check it out and see what you think - i think it's huge!

http://forum.metroamp.com/viewtopic.php ... 12#p309012" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

8) 8)

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Re: Van Halen Reverb

Post by Dig » Sun Jun 13, 2010 6:43 pm

Okay, here we go again :? I'm back at it. I don't have the Eventide delay or any of the other specific equipment specified by a few folks here, but stuff that should get me close. I've got my dry rig set. Then, with a line out from the dry rig, the signal goes into a Danelctro Reel Echo with tape sim and mix dial set completely to wet. From there the slapback delayed signal goes into a Roland SRV 2000 digital reverb unit and then into the power amp input of my Fender Super-Sonic. I've accomplished separating the dry and wet signals. My dilemma at this point is the wet/dry mix of the reverb unit. I can make it completely wet to where the only thing coming from the wet side is a slapback delayed reverb which is kind of strange. It's just like phantom reverb created by nothing. ... or I can mix some of the dry signal (which is actually the slapback from the true dry signal). Still, I'm not able to achieve that sound like dirtycooter was able to get on his clip where it sounds like there is this shallow pool of reverb swishing around at your ankles while the dry tone still hits you from the knees up. I'm getting some very cool, huge sounds, but still not that elusive reverb. :?:

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Re: Van Halen Reverb

Post by rgalpin » Sun Jun 13, 2010 10:02 pm

are you setting up and listening to it in the room while you are playing or recording it?

if you are listening in the room, are the cabs right next to each other? i would thing they would need to be and you would need to get away from them some in order to hear a good mix.

if you are recording, the piece you are missing is the second reverb that is stereo and sort of "glues" the wet to the dry.

with the verb cab - i would dial in just enough dry to give the beginning of the verb a slight definition of a slap - might help with the phantom verb perception. listen to the right side only of vh i and there's a little bit of the slap in there making some definition. adding some traction.

sounds like you've got some cool ingredients going.

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Re: Van Halen Reverb

Post by Dig » Sun Jun 13, 2010 10:46 pm

Thank you for the quick response! I think I have somehow overlooked this second reverb in all the posts I've read. :? Would you mind giving me a quick explaination of it? Where does it fit in the whole scheme? My SRV-2000 has stereo outputs, but I'm not sure if there is much I can do with that feature.
Regarding your questions and suggestions - I have come to the same conclusion that the cabs should be near eachother. However, I have had them about 10ft apart. Unfortunately for me, I won't be able to experiment with the rig for a few days as I am going out of town. :roll:
I look forward to your response regarding the second reverb. You and the rest of the folks on this forum have been extremely helpful. Thank you! :D

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Re: Van Halen Reverb

Post by rgalpin » Mon Jun 14, 2010 9:57 am

dirtycooder wrote:Instead-send a duplicated completely 100% wet 100ms delayed copy to the opposite side on the right.

This delay needs EQ'd maybe to taste however-then send THAT signal to the stereo reverb on an auxillary send.

mono dry on left-mono delayed detuned voice on the right-stereo verb popping up from the right delayed voice spreading over in stereo spilling onto the left channel slightly for stereo width.
in a live rig this would require a wet/dry/wet setup.

that said - here's this...
But reverb on recording and reverb on a live rig-well-Ed just never used verb live-ever. Not even laying the tracks in the studio. If it was ever added it was in the PA or in the studio monitors-post mic. Other than that he stuck with delays ever since the beginning starting with tape echos.
The bottleneck happens when using a very detailed verb and pushing it through a guitar speaker-not quite the same as playing back a mic'd guitar speaker and listening back to it on "full range hi fi speakers".
Issues with resonation from the verb inside the 4x12 can happen if its bassy on the verb-and can totally muck up some clear tones. Its possible to tweak for it-but its different and harder to do than just adding it post mic.

A killer wet side amp is the Randall RH100, 200, 250 etc-plug into the FX loop "return" from your FX's outputs-its uncolored mosfet cleaner reproduction than most tube power sections and is warm and nice sounding as a slave adding no distortion or color. But its mono so for stereo you'd need 2 of them for each wet side.

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Re: Van Halen Reverb

Post by Dig » Tue Jun 15, 2010 4:57 pm

Ah ha! Now I get it. Thanks! :)

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Re: Van Halen Reverb

Post by uiovbged332 » Wed Jul 06, 2022 8:59 pm

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