How about a high gain amp kit?

psychodave · Post by **psychodave** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 8:40 pm

I was thinking about ordering a Marshall clone kit, but I was going to mod it for high gain/ extra preamp tube and a tube buffered effects loop. I think there is a market for a high gain kit.

Post by **VelvetGeorge** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 9:17 pm

Great idea, Dave! I have been thinking that when I rewrite the 100 watt instructions, that I would also do a MV amp kit too. I don't see any reason not to include some extra gain mods. You really can get a lot of gain out of 4 gain stages in this arrangement.

George

funk49 · Post by **funk49** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 10:08 pm

The guy who is building my 12xxx clone amp currently is working under these specs. Amp will have two modes:

1) totally stock mode, with a master volume
2) Higher gain mode that utilizes an extra gain stage and effects loop, with master volume.

I wanted to experiment with an extra gain stage but didn't want to totally fubar the amp in the process. Since it's not some kind of vintage museum piece, I'm not concerned about the extra tube.

I'll be posting the results up there when the amp is finished. Oh, and I made sure to order the headcab in purple at an extra cost from Mojo!

bmf5150 · Post by **bmf5150** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 10:12 pm

that would be cool to make it switchable gain stage in or out of the amp!

Flames1950 · Post by **Flames1950** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 10:28 pm

psychodave wrote:I was thinking about ordering a Marshall clone kit, but I was going to mod it for high gain/ extra preamp tube and a tube buffered effects loop. I think there is a market for a high gain kit.

There is plenty of room for additional preamp tubes......in fact if George was serious about being authentic he'd have the fourth tube hole there for the tremolo option like the originals, with the little round blank-off plate......

5150loveeddie · Post by **5150loveeddie** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 11:58 pm

Flames1950 wrote:
psychodave wrote:I was thinking about ordering a Marshall clone kit, but I was going to mod it for high gain/ extra preamp tube and a tube buffered effects loop. I think there is a market for a high gain kit.
There is plenty of room for additional preamp tubes......in fact if George was serious about being authentic he'd have the fourth tube hole there for the tremolo option like the originals, with the little round blank-off plate......

joshwilson3 · Post by **joshwilson3** » Thu Jan 05, 2006 2:18 am

VelvetGeorge wrote:Great idea, Dave! I have been thinking that when I rewrite the 100 watt instructions, that I would also do a MV amp kit too. I don't see any reason not to include some extra gain mods. You really can get a lot of gain out of 4 gain stages in this arrangement.

George

That sounds great George. I like the idea of having a switch so you can keep it totally stock or having the 4 gain stages.

Would this sticktly be for the MV amps, or for the Super Leads? I've heard some people say they didn't like the extra tube in their Super Lead, but I don't know about in a MV amp.

While we're on this, I had a question. I'm undecided about this. Tell me which you would prefer: a MV 2203 amp, or a Super Lead with a preamp volume?

I can't decide which one to go with. I really like being able to dial in the preamp, but I wondered if this would sound good with a 1959 circuit?

thanks

novosibir · Post by **novosibir** » Thu Jan 05, 2006 9:18 am

Flames1950 wrote:There is plenty of room for additional preamp tubes......

Flames is right! Even six preamp tubes wouldn't be a problem with this chassis, so you easily can put in a 1959's and an independent 2203's circuit and an effects loop

Just to get the idea, how to place additional tubes onto this chassis, look at the photo!

Larry

Bainzy · Post by **Bainzy** » Thu Jan 05, 2006 12:16 pm

Yeah I put in an extra preamp tube in my 1959slp that with a DPDT switch is totally switchable between plexi and JCM800 spec (and even more gain with another DPDT switch if I used the other half of the extra tube). Sounds great for metal and is an easy mod.

Tatosh · Post by **Tatosh** » Thu Jan 05, 2006 5:27 pm

That would be a good idea. I have been thinking on building a high gainer too, since I already own two nmv maps. My choice for building now would be something like a ralle specs 67 or a later 2203 circuit.

Doesn´t the Roccaforte Hi Gain 100 has 4 stages of gain with only 3 preamp tubes? I will probably build something like that. So a kit for a 2203 circuit would be great as a starting point, I guess.

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Thu Jan 05, 2006 5:55 pm

Its just a modded 2203. It actually doesnt really even add any gain stages it just changes the values around a bit and changes the cathode follower into a normal cathode biased gain stage.

novosibir · Post by **novosibir** » Thu Jan 05, 2006 5:59 pm

Billy Batz wrote:Its just a modded 2203. It actually doesnt really even add any gain stages it just changes the values around a bit and changes the cathode follower into a normal cathode biased gain stage.

Like it's already been done with the Sovtek MIG100 - not really a great throw.

Larry

Post by **VelvetGeorge** » Thu Jan 05, 2006 6:16 pm

I was thinking of using the (4) gain stages available with (3) preamp tubes. But you easily add more.

There is plenty of room. You would run out of filament current before you ran out of space.

George

Bainzy · Post by **Bainzy** » Thu Jan 05, 2006 6:53 pm

If you got some chassis cut for 4 preamp tubes, I guess you might find a market for people building 1959T clones (if one exists - or would the market just consist of me?

).

But then there would be a problem in making the holes for the front panel, so you'd never have an accurate 1959T clone without getting a panel with extra holes and a different head cab. You'd probably end up having to adapt a 1959SL layout by putting the 2 extra controls on the back.

You know, these 12000 series clones people are building would still be accurate with a hole for a 4th preamp tube, as Marshall used to drill it out anyway and cover it up for amps with 3 tubes didn't they? That means one could build an accurate 12000 series clone with a 4-preamp-tube-holed chassis and then later on if they wanted an extra preamp tube, put one in there for more gain, tremelo, reverb, effects loop etc and be able to revert the amp back to an exact 12000 series clone whenever they wanted.

I'd much rather add in an extra preamp tube than convert the cathode follower to an extra gain stage, as that would change the feel of the amp quite a lot and if it could be switched back to stock with 1 switch, it'd still be pretty difficult (whereas it's dead simple when you add an extra tube to switch it in and out so its stock tonally).

novosibir · Post by **novosibir** » Thu Jan 05, 2006 6:53 pm

VelvetGeorge wrote:You would run out of filament current before you ran out of space.

I don't think, that this would be an issue!

Just as an example: Between '94 and '97 I've made more than 10 Marshall 2203 rebuildts with a "six-cylinder-engine", like you can see on the attached foto.

6 EL34 and 6 12AX7 are drawing a total current of 10.8 amps. The B+ with 6 power tubes was about 475 volts at idle and dropped down to 440 volts at full power with a current of about .45 amps. Neither the filament's secondary, nor the HT's secondary obviously had a problem with this. Some of these amps have been live on stage up to 3 hours total showtime - and they're all still alive!

I don't know, whether it's possible with the 1998 OT and with the laydown PT. But the Dagnall C2668 and the T4145 did it w/o any problems.

Larry

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How about a high gain amp kit?

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