Troubleshooting Hendrix's Bridge Pickup (woodstock)

[Brandon]

Hey everyone!

If you haven't been following my tone quest, I've been going after Hendrix's tone at Woodstock.

I have a Metropolous amp built with 1969 specs with all nos mullards, and I just got slider's pickups made with NOS wire.

These pickups sounds AMAZING. best pickups I've ever owned...

HOWEVER...

While the neck and middle sound unbelievable, the bridge pickup (as it has always been for me) is giving me trouble...

Hendrix's bridge pickup at Woodstock sounds very warm, fat and glassy all at the same time. It almost sounds as if a pickup and a humbucker had a baby.

My bridge sounds just too twangy, thin, and not very warm.

I'm wondering.... what is causing the gap??

I don't at all doubt these pickups or this amp. They both have unbelievable tone.

But getting it to where hendrix had it at woodstock... There must be something I'm missing, because I can get much, much closer to the bridge pickup tone with my Gibson SG on treble.

Things I've been considering that I'm missing from my setup:

- The original univibe is adding a tonal element
- The fact that he is splitting his cord into two amps is changing the impedance and affecting the tone
- The strings are old and dull, thus dulling out the tone


The curly cables HELP, but there is still a gap.

Please help, this has been driving me crazy. What can I do to achieve that tone?

[jcs]

Move the darn tone knob from the middle pu to the bridge pu!

I've done this for years and so have many others.

Some Strats are fuller sounding at the bridge than others imo.

[shakti]

Things I've been considering that I'm missing from my setup:

- The original univibe is adding a tonal element
- The fact that he is splitting his cord into two amps is changing the impedance and affecting the tone

You just answered your own question. Those two factors there are pretty dramatic, much more so than swapping a preamp tube. Though to be fair, the impedance shift is less of an issue when the Univibe is in line. Do you have any other amps? You don't have to turn on the other amp, just daisy-chain a cable to another amp with similar input impedance as a Marshall, and you can hear the effect it has.
The Univibe certainly also affects the sound.
Lastly, there's no substitute for a great-sounding guitar...not saying your guitar isn't, but modern day Strats usually just don't have "it" in my experience. Wish I could afford an old one, but second best will have to do. However, I can sense that you're hearing and feeling nuances that some people just don't hear, so I think you will understand what I'm saying. The whole setup is only as good as the weakest link...

[Brandon]

Hmm I don't have another amp!

Is there a way to somehow mimic the effect of the impedance? For instance can I plug into a radio or something else?

And can you tell me what exactly the univibe and the daisy chained impedance does to the tone? Ie does it cut highs? boost mids? etc.

[shakti]

Just the daisy chaining tends to thicken up things in the mids IMO. It could perhaps be perceived as a bass and treble roll-off as well.

The Uni-Vibe is a little harder to describe. Also note that I don't have an original Uni-Vibe, but it is a Castledine Supra-Vibe which is supposed to have the exact same preamp, and a cancel feature which leaves the preamp active. It has a volume control though, and I'm not sure what a stock setting on a Uni-Vibe would be, so I don't know if it boosts or cuts, but it takes on a slightly different feel, more than necessarily changing the EQ so much.

[Tone seaker]

Hendrix used a right hand strat flipped over so his bridge pickup angle was opposite of normal. The neck and middle pickups are strait so it does not matter.

[jcs]

The bridge pickup angle is completely different that's why i mentioned the bridge tone control mod (middle to bridge all you move is one wire).

Some things are very simple, but hey if you want to throw a bunch of money trying to get the bridge brightness tamed down, have at it.

[Brandon]

Perhaps your right jcs, and perhaps I'll give it a try, but I tend to be a perfectionist and just like shakti said there are subtle nuances to the time I'm looking for... and it's also about unraveling a mystery to me, not just about getting the tone you know ?

The more I get closer, te more I get things era correct, the closer I feel to the real authentic thing. I guess I would feel like I'm "cheating" if it's not wha was really happening in the electrical currents of jimis guitar and amps.

I am very committed to this! Someday I will have two full 69 stacks, a 69 strat and all original effects haha. And yes it will cost a small fortune, but lifes too short, might as well spend my money on what gives me great joy. To me, the tones and music coming out of jimis guitar is nothing short of magical, mysterious, pure love itself

With all of that said ill give the tone knob a switch and see how that works

[jcs]

Hey man, you can always reverse the tone control mod,it's very easy to do and has a drastic effect.

If you are that serious about copying Hendrix then you need to get a lefty Strat and play it upside down!

If not that, consider getting a pickguard with the reverse bridge position.

Other than changing out the bridge pu, these seem like your best options.

[Brandon]

I have an old cheapo 50w solid state crate amp somewhere, I wonder if that will work?

I sent the people at Castledine an email about if they can build me a custom pedal that simply reproduces the "Cancel" effect. I really don't have an extra $500 at the moment to spend on another uni-vibe haha Hopefully I'll hear back from them soon.

@Tone Seaker & jcs I am a lefty playing on a right handed flipped for lefties, just like jimi.

A part of me wonders though if something more is going on beneath the surface of the pickguard, specifically of the bridge pickup.... I guess I'll crack that nut once I get this impedance/uni-vibe cancel business sorted out, if I have to

[bigsmitty]

on my partscaster i put a jumper so the middle tone works on the bride also

[yladrd61]

Jimi also had a non true bypass wah, and a fuzz face is probably silicon and then the univibe also you have to take into acount that you are not hearing what was coming out of the speakers you are hearing what the microphone put to tape. I hope that helps also try experimenting with pickup height { Lower } and another pointer I have is to roll the guitar volume back a little to roll of some of the highs PS: String Guages 010,013,015,026,032,038 according to Roger Mayer Also Jimi had Right handed pickups upside down, so you would need left handed pickups turned upside down to be the same.

[jcs]

Brandon mentioned the neck and middle pu sound fine, if you darken up the rest of your signal it will change the neck and middle pu.

Thats why i still contend the bridge tone pot mod is worth a try....that or another bridge pu!

Be glad you have the middle and neck sounding right! Folks are constantly switching out entire sets of pickups in Strats....it can be very time consuming and costly trying to get a Strat just right with all pickups properly balanced.

[yladrd61]

Jimi's favorite '69 Super Lead was shared cathode, and his strat did not have a tone control on the bridge pick up. Most of the woodstock set was played on the bridge pickup. Every strat bridge pick up I have ever tried on the '69 (2.7K ohm,.68uf) Spec High Treble Channel has been like sticking an ice pick in my ear tone control or not. Shared Cathode (820 ohm, 250uf or 330uf) works way better for a Strat single coil bridge pick up no more ice pick. It does not make it darker it allows more low frequencies to pass on to the next gain stage, and was the standard V1 configuration from the 5F6A Bassman until 1968

[jcs]

yladrd61, good accurate info.....I have a 71 Smallbox 50, i know how bright and biting they can be LOL! I must add, i have a line on a real 68 Strat and the bridge pu in this guitar is much more balanced with the middle & neck pu.

In other words the bridge is not overly bright with the standard 'no tone on the bridge pu' Strat setup and i honestly can't say its bassy for a bridge pu.

Finding a very balanced Strat is not easy and i agree more bass from the bridge pu is probably whats needed in Brandons case.

Hard to compare Jimi's particular Woodstock Strat to off the shelf Strats and perhaps the neck and middle were so bassy that Hendrix had to rely on the bridge pu at Woodstock?

This gets to be in 'Randy Hansen' territory, the guy who did a pretty respectable job of emulating Hendrix since the 70's (is he even still around?)