S.I.R. 100W SuperLead Schematic pt. II

[bennyx]

so, if the frank mods do not compress like Billy said why add a 10k stage? 10k compress!

stop.....you don't have read correctly....Frank have said "39 was born using an idea behind making a Billy Squier mod....."

the Squier mod isn't like 36.....

"Frank Levi reworked these for me over the course of many nights of creative abuse." in this time Frank have test several ideas for make a Squier sound.....he have developed that idea on econd time in a 39/36 mod......
so 10k have a compression but 150k on gain pot remove compression......

so Frank have said " i have remove all first stage Caswell mod and a switching system" but don't have remove 10k stage (third stage).....if none ear a smilar sound of 34 and 36 probably Frank have accurately mimic very badly.....perhaps it was deaf.....or maybe he has listened well (and know the scheme for mimic better) and someone here not .....the better way for mimic an amp without change the voicing are add or remove a 10k stage and add or remove bright.....if you add 10k you must be remove bright (like 2203 have 1000pf bright cap, plexi have 5000pf), so, if 34 have 1000pf and you add 10k stage you must be remove totally the bright cap....and add a 470pf/470k mixer.....thats is the better way for mimic the tone of an amp......with more compression and gain....and vice versa....if try this experiment: take a 1959, add a master volume pre phase, put gain on 10....take 2203 and put gain on 10......both amps with master low, sound very similar or very mimic with a little bit compression difference....the only real difference between 2203 and 1959 are master volume that make a different PI saturation ohm different volume

[pjoliver182]

Frank was asked by Glenn to mod an amp to sound like Caswell's #39..."the earliest of these experiments was stock #36". I think #34 was just a slightly later experiment.

Amp techs don't rip the whole circuit apart, they make subtle changes by adding a minimal number of components. This is a pcb amp we're talking about remember!

I think Frank borrowed the first two cathodes of tim's #39 and the shield trick. I think those are the only similarities between the 3 amps.

The best spec I arrived at...and Herb...and Duke...and probably others is when I took everything out of my amp that you had said was DEFINITELY correct and that Frank had confirmed etc...and then used my brain and my ears.

Massive thanks to Nigel and Kevin incidentally!

[pjoliver182]

No need for that Benny...

[bennyx]

Amp techs don't rip the whole circuit apart, they make subtle changes by adding a minimal number of components. This is a pcb amp we're talking about remember!

what not clear in this words exactly?


"Tim Caswell’s modded #39 sat on the shelf, unused. Frank convinced Glen Buckley (head of Q.C. department) to let him re-work #39 an install his own mod.

Frank removed all of the components that Tim Caswell had added on the 1st tube of #39 including the switching capability. He then installed his own mod and #39 FL SuperKill #1 was born. This is the #39 that everyone loves and is talking about.
Due to the popularity of #39, Glen asked Frank to modify #36 to be the same as #39. Thus #36 FL SuperKill was born. Both #39 and #36 were almost always out on rentals. SIR needed one more amp like #39 and #36. The only available amp was #34, a 2203 Marshall. Frank modified #34 to accurately mimic the 39/36 sound. Thus the #34 FL CUSTOM was born"

Frank Levi words....not mine......

34 with 10k added stage isn't a raped amp.....but Caswell heavy rape his amp for his mod.....

[pjoliver182]

Forget it Benny...I won't discuss it with you anymore after that tirade of abuse. I'm only interested in helping others...not you anymore.

[bennyx]

No problem i will survive.....it'so frustrating speak with a person that not read and don't want listen....i don't know cause me, an italian that don't speak perfect english i understand exactly the Levi's words, when i have meet i don't have any problems to understand his concept, and many people in this post, with better language don't understand concept.....for me all is clear....

[novosibir]

Amp techs don't rip the whole circuit apart, they make subtle changes by adding a minimal number of components. This is a pcb amp we're talking about remember!

No, sometimes they do. They sometimes rip out the entire circuit and build up the amp completely new.

[snakepit86]

so, if the frank mods do not compress like Billy said why add a 10k stage? 10k compress!

stop.....you don't have read correctly....Frank have said "39 was born using an idea behind making a Billy Squier mod....."

the Squier mod isn't like 36.....

"Frank Levi reworked these for me over the course of many nights of creative abuse." in this time Frank have test several ideas for make a Squier sound.....he have developed that idea on econd time in a 39/36 mod......
so 10k have a compression but 150k on gain pot remove compression......

so Frank have said " i have remove all first stage Caswell mod and a switching system" but don't have remove 10k stage (third stage).....if none ear a smilar sound of 34 and 36 probably Frank have accurately mimic very badly.....perhaps it was deaf.....or maybe he has listened well (and know the scheme for mimic better) and someone here not .....the better way for mimic an amp without change the voicing are add or remove a 10k stage and add or remove bright.....if you add 10k you must be remove bright (like 2203 have 1000pf bright cap, plexi have 5000pf), so, if 34 have 1000pf and you add 10k stage you must be remove totally the bright cap....and add a 470pf/470k mixer.....thats is the better way for mimic the tone of an amp......with more compression and gain....and vice versa....if try this experiment: take a 1959, add a master volume pre phase, put gain on 10....take 2203 and put gain on 10......both amps with master low, sound very similar or very mimic with a little bit compression difference....the only real difference between 2203 and 1959 are master volume that make a different PI saturation ohm different volume

that makes a lot of logic to me Benny.

I have one question that its been around in my mind for a long time, thinking as a 80s tech, why not to add the extra gain stage in front of all, i mean between the input jack and the 2k/680n orignal stage.

Second question is anyone tryed cascading a plexi with master? i have with the RR marshall and sounded great, corious think is that the normal channel comes first and the bright later, so makes 820/330uf fist gain stage and 2k7/680n second, add a 10k stage in front and you will have a seroius high gain. I found 330uf very big and i prefeer something between 1uf to 47uf.(4.7uf seems to work nice a la bogner HElios)

After all this years o really want to say that this is by far the longest and coolest thread of all times!

[herbvis]

Amp techs don't rip the whole circuit apart, they make subtle changes by adding a minimal number of components. This is a pcb amp we're talking about remember!

No, sometimes they do. They sometimes rip out the entire circuit and build up the amp completely new.

Damn Larry! Nice clean work!!!!

Frank said he ripped out Caswells mod and put his own in. I think he probably removed the switching circuit. I would have too judging by the SIRcaswell schematic that is floating around. Nothing in place to control the channel bleed.
I was texting with frank a few years ago and he mentioned he had just worked on a caswell modded amp. I dont remember exactly what he said, but it was along the lines of it being a pain in the ass. lol

[bennyx]

so, if the frank mods do not compress like Billy said why add a 10k stage? 10k compress!

stop.....you don't have read correctly....Frank have said "39 was born using an idea behind making a Billy Squier mod....."

the Squier mod isn't like 36.....

"Frank Levi reworked these for me over the course of many nights of creative abuse." in this time Frank have test several ideas for make a Squier sound.....he have developed that idea on econd time in a 39/36 mod......
so 10k have a compression but 150k on gain pot remove compression......

so Frank have said " i have remove all first stage Caswell mod and a switching system" but don't have remove 10k stage (third stage).....if none ear a smilar sound of 34 and 36 probably Frank have accurately mimic very badly.....perhaps it was deaf.....or maybe he has listened well (and know the scheme for mimic better) and someone here not .....the better way for mimic an amp without change the voicing are add or remove a 10k stage and add or remove bright.....if you add 10k you must be remove bright (like 2203 have 1000pf bright cap, plexi have 5000pf), so, if 34 have 1000pf and you add 10k stage you must be remove totally the bright cap....and add a 470pf/470k mixer.....thats is the better way for mimic the tone of an amp......with more compression and gain....and vice versa....if try this experiment: take a 1959, add a master volume pre phase, put gain on 10....take 2203 and put gain on 10......both amps with master low, sound very similar or very mimic with a little bit compression difference....the only real difference between 2203 and 1959 are master volume that make a different PI saturation ohm different volume

that makes a lot of logic to me Benny.

I have one question that its been around in my mind for a long time, thinking as a 80s tech, why not to add the extra gain stage in front of all, i mean between the input jack and the 2k/680n orignal stage.

Second question is anyone tryed cascading a plexi with master? i have with the RR marshall and sounded great, corious think is that the normal channel comes first and the bright later, so makes 820/330uf fist gain stage and 2k7/680n second, add a 10k stage in front and you will have a seroius high gain. I found 330uf very big and i prefeer something between 1uf to 47uf.(4.7uf seems to work nice a la bogner HElios)

After all this years o really want to say that this is by far the longest and coolest thread of all times!

Many years ago i wasn't the same infos that i've now......so i've tried all possible combinations of various mods....so i've tried also one wired mod and cascade mod.....don't sound correct....don't have mid bass, don't have a caracteristic sound.....the only way for clone the sweet child twangy is work on 34 mod....after listen the afd100 investigation where Slash play nightrain and sweet child with crancked 34 i was convinced that 34 and 36 are as common circuit simply change speakers and setting,, on second time Frank have confirmed that 34 is a cloned voicing of 36, so near that "accurately mimic".....on several afd songs you can listen on solos or intro that the amp twang using a neck pick up... On second time i've search the right gain and compression for make wttj song.....the only way for mimic a sound is use the same voicing stages....most people mistake the shield trick.....so the sound isn't good...shield trick make in sound a sort of sleaze on the sound ....if you use it on first and second as Frank said that effect increase....shield trick is a beast....if you use a cable is hard to find the right lenght for correct sound, if you use caps, add a resistor and hard to find right value....shield trick remove compression and make the sound on mids

[pjoliver182]

No, sometimes they do. They sometimes rip out the entire circuit and build up the amp completely new.

Haha ok Larry! Not really a "mod" though is it? Looks like a beast; which of your amps it that one?

[pjoliver182]

"why not to add the extra gain stage in front of all, i mean between the input jack and the 2k/680n orignal stage."

I always expected the extra stage to be between input and V1a (820/330). 2k7/680n is the second 'stage' in the stock circuit remember.

Had #36 been a ptp amp I'd bet this would have been the case. We've seen before in Franks other work that he used to like wiring amps from left to right; when cascading a plexi for example V1B would always be stock (and always the second stage) then he'd tweak V1a and v2a to get the tone and gain for a particular customer.

If Glenn hadn't asked him to make #36 sound like #39, I'm sure he'd have tried putting the added stage in front and made minimal tweaks to the stock cascaded circuit to get what he wanted.

[bennyx]

Had #36 been a ptp amp I'd bet this would have been the case. We've seen before in Franks other work that he used to like wiring amps from left to right; when cascading a plexi for example V1B would always be stock (and always the second stage) then he'd tweak V1a and v2a to get the tone and gain for a particular customer.

If Glenn hadn't asked him to make #36 sound like #39, I'm sure he'd have tried putting the added stage in front and made minimal tweaks to the stock cascaded circuit to get what he wanted.

this is DeMartini amp with Levi mod.....not 36...but have changed half components of pcb.....and i don't see bright cap....first and second stage are totally changed and in series like 2203 or cascade or onewired mod.....i see a shield trick

[bennyx]

that's Caswell 39

[pjoliver182]

this is DeMartini amp with Levi mod.....not 36...but have changed half components of pcb.....and i don't see bright cap....first and second stage are totally changed and in series like 2203 or cascade or onewired mod.....i see a shield trick

Good stuff Benny; I see some #36 clues in there...

This is what I meant by 'how Frank mods amps in the 80's'