Metropoulos Forum

So I just won a '68 Bandmaster off of ebay. It has assorted unknown american preamp tubes and RCA 6L6 power tubes. I've only got one cab ... a '68 basketweave with 55hz Celestion blackback G12Ms. It's 16 ohm so I know it's not the best match.

I also have two loose Celestion Greenback RIs and two G12H30s.

What speakers will sound best with it? Will the Celestions be good or should I go for an American clone like the Jensen's or the Eminence? Those are both pretty cheap so I'm not afraid to buy them ... the Weber's are probably a lot more so I'll stay away from that option for now.

Also, what would be the best magnet choice ... alnico or ceramic. The Jensen's I'm looking at are either the P12N or C12R. For Eminene it's the Legend 122 ... and then I already have the Celestions.

This will be mostly for clean Hendrixy, Rockabilly, chicken pickin stuff. Got my Marshall for the nastier tones.

Another question for Flames and Dan ...

The '68s are the same as the earlier blackface amps, right?

The actual circuit is the same. Thsi may not be totally accurate but I think the deal was after the CBS buyout the basic amps remained the same for a few years until stocks were used up then the bean counters who did the purchasing screwed up the name with replacment materials. But around 68 the faceplate was one of the only important things that changed.

Not necessarily......just like most Fenders in the lineup, the Bandmaster got revised by CBS' finest with an AC568 circuit, partially cathode biased power tubes, all sorts of small caps to hide oscillations due to lead dress screwups, 47K plate resistors on the phase inverter, bias balance control, yuck.
So if it's an early enough '68 you'll be in good shape. A later '68 (after May, since the revision was 5/68) it's a potshot whether yours has the old circuit or new. If the auction had chassis pics and the amp is stock, look for the big ceramic-covered wirewound 150 ohm 7 watt resistors off the power tube cathodes, an easy-to-spot telltale sign. But they are pretty easy to convert to the earlier circuit, and anytime you can get an all-tube, all handwired amp for $300 I wouldn't bitch too hard.
The AB763 circuit stays nice and sparkly even cranked -- at least with a Fender guitar. Your Gibsons will get it overdriving though.

On speakers, if you want Webers but don't want to drop a lotta dough, try his plain old Signature 12 ceramic. I put a pair in my tall 2x12 Bandmaster cab and they do a great cop of the blackface-era tone (many of these Fenders got Utahs, Oxfords or CTS speakers which were not really great speakers, so the Webers are probably even an improvement over those.) When I got mine they were $45 each, but Ted only charged me $35 each.........I wasn't gonna ask. I'd sure get the Sig 12's over the RI Jensen stuff. The new Eminence lineups may have something really good too, but probably more $$ than the Sig 12.

Thanks, I'll post a gut pic when I get the amp.

I just read the auction description and it says AB763

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... %3AIT&rd=1

Looks like I'm going to do a little tweaking to make it a blackface.

Edit: oops! I just re-read your reply and it looks like I already have the good circuit??

The guy's claim is based on the tube chart. Fender is well-known for using up old tube charts without regard to what circuit is actually in the amp (for instance, Bassman heads -- there are AA165's labelled AA864; AB165's labelled AA165; and plenty of AC568's, like I had, labelled AB165. I don't think I have ever seen anyone come up with an AC568 tube chart as a matter of fact, so these amps were mislabelled for years, until the AA270 circuit at least.)

You won't know until you yank the chassis what is really there. But the conversions aren't hard.

I can always give you the serial on mine which is (was) an AB763. Im not sure how the Fender serials go. Theyre definitely not reliable. It seems like with both from 68 they may match up to a degree and possibly tell if yours is earlier, which, if it is, its probably an AB763

Hey Chris

Its nice to see someone interested in some great clean fender tones. I have four blackface fenders and one silverface fender. I love em. Some of the early slverface amps were the same as the blackface. Flames is right. The huge resistors off the power tubes is one of the sure signs that it has the silverface circuit. But you can change it. Hopefully you still have the blue capacitors on the board. All of mine still have them and they sound great. Not sure why everyone puts the orange drops in, because I love em with those blue capacitors.

Wes

Hey Wes!
I can't wait to open that sucker up. I have no idea how stock it is but I have a feeling it's fairly untouched ... it sounds like it even has the original tubes in it.

my bandmaster was a 68 but it had the AB763 circuit when I got it. If your going for cleaner rockabilly type of tones I don't the celestions would be your ticket. I ran mine thru a 4x12 with greenbacks for a year, it gave a slightly marshall type of vibe on the overdrive and broke up pretty quick. I'm now running thru a '65 bassman 2x12 cab with original cone c12n jensens. A jensen style speaker would probably work great for the tone your going for, maybe even a jbl type if you only want clean. I also agree with Flames in saying don't even consider the Jensen reissues, they are horrible and do not sound like the original speakers at all. I say that from first hand experience in several amps. Weber is your best bet, even the signature series are decent speakers. Eminence also has some cool american style speakers though not exact copies of any vintage piece.