Metropoulos Forum

hi amp dudes. has anyone used the fabric softener on
the speaker cone treatment to soften or loosen up
the cone? if so how much do you use, what concentration
and most importantly did it do any good?

jimmy owner of a stiff as a board g12h30 heritage

Ive done this on my reissue g-12m 25's It doesnt take much I mixed about 50 50
in a spray bottle and just gave them a quick wisp to cover the the whole speaker
you dont want to totally saturate them Just a quick spray and wipe off the ecess
let em dry and re install.. they did take away some of the harshness.. so be care full

Be real careful...you can ruin the cone if you douse it with too much of that stuff. I've heard from a few folks who tried it...asking me if I would recone their Celestions with a Scumback kit. So proceed with caution.

Weber sometimes uses the fabric softener trick to age/soften up new cones. But he's a professional. Like Jim said - CAREFUL!

If you email Ted he might even tell you how to do it properly.

wow thanks for your answers. this gives
me an idea of what to do. this speaker is way too harsh
a g12h30 heritage. if i ruin it i will recone it. its an experiment
to see if i can get it to sound halfway desent. ill report
my results.

jimmy

jbzoso2002 wrote:wow thanks for your answers. this gives
me an idea of what to do. this speaker is way too harsh
a g12h30 heritage. if i ruin it i will recone it. its an experiment
to see if i can get it to sound halfway desent. ill report
my results.

jimmy

I've bought the Heritage G12H30 three times, new, used and finally really used as the 4th owner. Even the 3rd "really used" one (over 120 hours of gig volume and around 20-40 home volume hours according to the previous owners) was bright and unusable when I got it, which is why I paid so little for it, I'm sure.

I wound up putting it on a variac for awhile. For "awhile" I mean a total of 9 days, 9 hours per day (while my neighbors were gone to work), along with a G12M Heritage I also bought used. I checked the speakers' tone every two days, and stopped when it got to a usable one.

I know a variac's constant signal, set properly, can simulate about 2-3 times the speed of normal break in. But 80 hours of variac, plus the original 120 from the previous owners comes in around 250-300 hours of break in time at gig volumes.

After I did this the two speakers were usable.

In real life, though, this would have been the equivalent of someone playing at gig volume one hour per day, 5 days per week for 14-16 months. So the break in time to remove that upper frequency thing is, to say the least, considerable.

Those were the 16 ohm models. Now I'm checking to see if the 8 ohm models are any different, same goes for the two Cele Golds (8 & 16 ohm) I bought this year, used.

jbzoso2002 wrote:wow thanks for your answers. this gives
me an idea of what to do. this speaker is way too harsh
a g12h30 heritage. if i ruin it i will recone it. its an experiment
to see if i can get it to sound halfway desent. ill report
my results.

jimmy

Sounds like another episode of "Tube Talk" with Jim and Jerr.

jimmy [/quote]

Sounds like another episode of "Tube Talk" with Jim and Jerr. [/quote]




jimmy

I know a variac's constant signal, set properly, can simulate about 2-3 times the speed of normal break in. But 80 hours of variac, plus the original 120 from the previous owners comes in around 250-300 hours of break in time at gig volumes.

After I did this the two speakers were usable.

In real life, though, this would have been the equivalent of someone playing at gig volume one hour per day, 5 days per week for 14-16 months. So the break in time to remove that upper frequency thing is, to say the least, considerable.

Those were the 16 ohm models. Now I'm checking to see if the 8 ohm models are any different, same goes for the two Cele Golds (8 & 16 ohm) I bought this year, used.

Jim What the deal with the variac ??? How do you set it up ???

worked this all out several months ago with Ted. Here's what you need to do if you have a variac.

Variac break in times:

Speaker Imp Speaker Power Rating Break in Voltage How Long?
8___________ 65____________13.165____________2 to 3 hours for all
8___________ 30 ____________ 8.9
16___________65 ___________ 18.61
16__________ 30 ___________ 12.64
8 __________ 100 ___________ 16.325
16 __________100 ___________ 23.094

The 2-3 hours amount is just a light break in. If you're attempting to fully break in a speaker on a variac, it will take 20 hours each. That's two full days while you're at work.

Set the voltage to the amount listed, wire up the speakers. Turn the speakers on their magnets, cones facing up. Double check your wiring, then turn on the variac for the specified amount of hours. I recommend 2-4 sessions so you don't potentially overheat the coils. The noise will be obnoxious and make your teeth grate. Leave the house, or do this in the garage or a closed closet if you have to be at home. But it's better to leave the house altogether, if possible.

The variac costs anywhere from $75 - $150 for decent model. You'll have to make up cables to wire them in PARALLEL to break them all in at the same time, for the least amount of time spent breaking them in. If you wire them in series you have add more hours and more voltage, so wire them in parallel when you attempt this.

You must NOT exceed the limits set forth above.


i copyed this from jim's previous post

jimmy

jbzoso2002 wrote:i copyed this from jim's previous post

jimmy

Thanks for using the search function (or copying it down when you first saw it, whichever)!!!

how about using a Su[perBass head and a Bass guitar?? Of course dont blow the speaker but would this break them in quicker?? Say my HW Marshall cab?? Just some playing? Or maybe even just tap the Bass,set it on a stand in front of the cab and just letergo?? For a few hrs.Would that do any good?? Probally be not to good on My Marshall amp

beaulieu wrote:how about using a Su[perBass head and a Bass guitar?? Of course dont blow the speaker but would this break them in quicker?? Say my HW Marshall cab?? Just some playing? Or maybe even just tap the Bass,set it on a stand in front of the cab and just letergo?? For a few hrs.Would that do any good?? Probally be not to good on My Marshall amp

I had a 412 V30 cab on my JTM45 a while ago and one day a friend came over here and connected his bass to my JTM45, played it for a couple of hours, and after a couple of hours I plugged in my guitar and I couldn't believe the difference in sound before and after playing bass over it. Much improved and much smoother!
I now have a 1960AHW cab and been asking him when he has the time to come over with his bass
The JTM45 is a direct copy of the Fender bassman and as such basicly a bass amp, and I THINK those G12H30 55hz HERITAGE speakers in that 1960AHW were originally designed for bass as well so I don't think there's any harm in doing such.
Maybe Jim can confirm those speakers were originally built for bass?

Yes, the original Pre Rola versions of the G12H30 55hz were considered as "bass cones".

The Heritage does not sound like those, though. Sorry.

I'll bet if you pounded them with bass for several hours that would help, but don't get confused here...what the Heritage line is doing is cashing in on the vintage name...not replicating the tone.

Southbay Ampworks wrote:Yes, the original Pre Rola versions of the G12H30 55hz were considered as "bass cones".

The Heritage does not sound like those, though. Sorry.

I'll bet if you pounded them with bass for several hours that would help, but don't get confused here...what the Heritage line is doing is cashing in on the vintage name...not replicating the tone.

thats for damn sure! my g12h30 heritage sounded harsh
at best. i feel riped off by celestion on this one!!!

jimmy