2 Variac's clip

[rgalpin]

To my ears the difference between with and without the 2nd variac is like the difference between SOAP OPERA VIDEO and FILM. It's like you are hearing the same tone on both but adding the 2nd variac just adds something that makes it have quality and depth.

When I listened at first I forgot that you had said that the first half was without the 2nd variac. And a little ways in I was feeling like "hmmmmm..." maybe it was something else about the previous clip that was so convincing - mic placement maybe or even just the riff selection - then you paused and I remembered that the first half was without - and so I began to lick my chops waiting for the second half and lo and behold YES - FILM compared to SOAP OPERA VIDEO. Same tone - just better.

Is the mic placement the same?

Interesting how the feedback on the ITO ending came out like with the exact same note and feel as the album.

This new clip is panned harder to the right and so it's a little too far over there for my ear compared to the first clip.

Also the first clip had the Meanstreet and WHATGTG riffs which are more about that later nuanced sound. The riffs in the new clip are not as much about that (VH I) so trying to compare 70V to 85V on the first variac is not quite apples to apples.

Getting my popcorn now and hoping to hear some more lightning in a bottle... panned a little bit toward the middle and Meanstreet and WHATGTG... ?? haha!! Thanks for your hard work on this - it's really got me back to thinking about this stuff again.

[rgalpin]

Is the 2nd variac just all about the copper? I don't get it. And most importantly i don't have a 2nd variac so of course I'm trying to figure out how i can get these magic beans without getting out my credit card.

How is this different (probably a myriad of ways) than using a giant speaker cable - or just inserting like a 100' roll of wire inbetween amp and cab. Am I way off? What else is happening in the variac? i know... who cares if it works. but those who can't do - pontificate. lol.

[rgalpin]

skipped around the timeline on that new clip and took my head phones off since the hard pan was distracting me - and listen to the FYLT bit where you lead up to the sustained B chord... go back and forth between NO variac and variac - that second variac is magic beans in your setup - that is WILD!!

ok - 3 posts in a row - i'll shut up.

[plexified]

Rob , you always come through with the best descriptions man . I would interpret with this attempt. You know when you record in the digital realm and they have the sterile , stiff , lifeless feel? Its been understood its the exactness of a beat or the cleanliness of a signal . When you dirty that shit up with imperfections it comes to life , like an actual human did it , not a stinking robot. Especially when using robo drum tracks . Right ? I think this effect is a pseudo junk in the trunk thing man , its like giving you forgiveness so to speak. And you got me thinking about all those super insane long cables Ed used in some live pics , I was always like , But its like introduced imperfections! Man I thought I was imperfect enough

[plexified]

Oops , thought not over , Would it not be cool or what to see how many Variacs Rob could use while employing one to control line voltage , while slaving of course , so one for each head and then on the sauce into the cab. WO HOO , that's some fun stuff man would sound insane I'm sure . Not only Robs sound , but watch out when he has new infused inspiration. Better keep the tape running man , your already dangerous , we don't want to miss a note my friend . Plexified as usual

[plexified]

I'll go for three too Rob , Forget to say that was some SICK TONE right their James , playing killed it too . So awesome to here these success stories man , I had that loud and proud through my stereo and its just beautiful tone.

[jnew]

Thanks David but hey man, this really needs to be better exampled by you good players. Seriously. I struggle to make a point with a guitar.

Ok Rob, I shortened it up with Mean Street only and Panned it much more center. Mic position is exact on both takes here. (Although I don't think it's the same position as the very first clip. Rambunctious dog )
This clip, same as before with first take without the 2nd variac, second take with. Same differences can be heard.

David will have to explain the exact details. I can only hypothesize on what happens and in my mind, it'd be along the lines of a 200-300 foot speaker cable.

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_so ... D=13193390

[JimiJames]

Do you see what you did ? Do you see what you did ! !
Now... you got these guys postin' in triplicate form ? WTF jnew ! ehh... me likey play triplets

[plexified]

look at the core , its pure copper , perhaps hundreds of feet . Its large gauge and in a cylindrical scenario with a winding pattern . Yeah , physics , gotta love it . Laquer dipped pure copper solid wire about an 8 gauge wound by a robot in a China factory , maybe suicide catch nets outside , working for a bowl of rice a day , yep could have been made in America but was outsourced for profit . Oh well , next question ....

[Star*Guitar]

There is definitely a more 3D sound with the attenuator at the speakers. A delay because of the lengths of copper due and increased capacitance is a good theory. However, I think their may a possibility of some sort of phase correction going on here.. Just a thought. Also, my worry using this set up is the head not seeing the proper load. Anyone have any thoughts about that? I would be scared as hell trying that on a vintage amp but the tone is definitely an improvement. There isn't much debate there.

[jnew]

Did you just call my variac an attenuator? WHY I OUGHTA!

I measured the cab with and without the variac in the speaker cable chain. 14.7 Ohms in both cases. I don't have a 200 -300 foot speaker cable but I think it would be an interesting comparison. Maybe someone has a long ass cable from an old PA system they could try? David seems to think it's pretty safe. I've played for 2-3 hours at a time by this point. So far there's not any issues.

Last night, I took the 330uF off of V2 and tried it in parallel to the .68 on V1B. Don't know if anyone ever thought to try this but I remember a guy who had been in Ed's amp saying there was something done to add a little bass to the lead channel, that he preferred to keep to himself. Well this would certainly do just that. And it does. I think it was a John Suhr interview. Anyways, it is a very interesting result and makes a big step in the VHII tone direction. I'll try and make a clip and post. Got an unexpected visitor in from Santa Barbara last night so I'm kind of hosting a tour in and around Palm Desert.

[JimiJames]

Leaving just the .68μ in V2A, then taking the 330μF in parallel with V1B's .68μ = adds a little bass to the lead channel.
Wonder what a 220μF would do +/- ? Anything else in parallel ?
What is your V1B plate bypass cap ? .022 or .0022

[Star*Guitar]

[quote="jnew"]Did you just call my variac an attenuator? WHY I OUGHTA!

My bad, but hey it is an attenuator of sorts!! Lol I still have Chris M's Original post on this saved locally on my hard drive. With all respect to Davd, he is a great guy and a fun read, (I could be mistaken) but but I don't think he is a electronics engineer. That leaves me pause. If Chris M. signed off on it then I'm good to go. I will have to go back and refer to that original post.

I measured the cab with and without the variac in the speaker cable chain. 14.7 Ohms in both cases. I don't have a 200 -300 foot speaker cable but I think it would be an interesting comparison. Maybe someone has a long ass cable from an old PA system they could try? David seems to think it's pretty safe. I've played for 2-3 hours at a time by this point. So far there's not any issues.

Good info, I would the think around 15 ohms is good enough. That makes me feel better about it.

Last night, I took the 330uF off of V2 and tried it in parallel to the .68 on V1B. Don't know if anyone ever thought to try this but I remember a guy who had been in Ed's amp saying there was something done to add a little bass to the lead channel, that he preferred to keep to himself. Well this would certainly do just that. And it does. I think it was a John Suhr interview. Anyways, it is a very interesting result and makes a big step in the VHII tone direction. I'll try and make a clip and post. Got an unexpected visitor in from Santa Barbara last night so I'm kind of hosting a tour in and around Palm Desert. [/quote)

Man you're a mad scientist lately.. Awesome!!!




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[jnew]

Just added the 330uF across the .68 on V1B. .0022 coupler on V1B.

[jnew]

Did you just call my variac an attenuator? WHY I OUGHTA!

My bad, but hey it is an attenuator of sorts!! Lol I still have Chris M's Original post on this saved locally on my hard drive. With all respect to Davd, he is a great guy and a fun read, (I could be mistaken) but but I don't think he is a electronics engineer. That leaves me pause. If Chris M. signed off on it then I'm good to go. I will have to go back and refer to that original post.

I measured the cab with and without the variac in the speaker cable chain. 14.7 Ohms in both cases. I don't have a 200 -300 foot speaker cable but I think it would be an interesting comparison. Maybe someone has a long ass cable from an old PA system they could try? David seems to think it's pretty safe. I've played for 2-3 hours at a time by this point. So far there's not any issues.

Good info, I would the think around 15 ohms is good enough. That makes me feel better about it.

Last night, I took the 330uF off of V2 and tried it in parallel to the .68 on V1B. Don't know if anyone ever thought to try this but I remember a guy who had been in Ed's amp saying there was something done to add a little bass to the lead channel, that he preferred to keep to himself. Well this would certainly do just that. And it does. I think it was a John Suhr interview. Anyways, it is a very interesting result and makes a big step in the VHII tone direction. I'll try and make a clip and post. Got an unexpected visitor in from Santa Barbara last night so I'm kind of hosting a tour in and around Palm Desert. [/quote)

Man you're a mad scientist lately.. Awesome!!!

I know but it fun.




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