Metropoulos Forum

Which power transformers being made currently replicate the proper 'sag' in a dimed plexi ?

1. RACKSYSTEMS wrote:

Wow it's amazing what theory's can come about here. You want a transformer that does the sag the classic tone one does. Or the Marstran. The 100 watt amp I worked on was the amp on all the records. This is straight from Ed.

2. Roe wrote:

yes, the marstran 1203-80s and t2562s sag like the originals do (roughly 90v at full distortion). Its nice to hear that the classictone PTs also has the correct sag.


http://forum.metroamp.com/viewtopic.php ... 72#p402072" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

N3m0 7h3 Fi5h wrote:1. RACKSYSTEMS wrote:

Wow it's amazing what theory's can come about here. You want a transformer that does the sag the classic tone one does. Or the Marstran. The 100 watt amp I worked on was the amp on all the records. This is straight from Ed.

2. Roe wrote:

yes, the marstran 1203-80s and t2562s sag like the originals do (roughly 90v at full distortion). Its nice to hear that the classictone PTs also has the correct sag.


http://forum.metroamp.com/viewtopic.php ... 72#p402072" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I have personal experience with the following transformers; Mercury Mag, Classic Tone, Heyboer and a couple others, BUT NOT the Marstran. I can tell you that NON of the transformers sag like the original T2562 (or 1203-80 for that matter). I am not calling or implying Dave F. is a liar (please do not mis-understand). I'm only speaking from my experience and I can promise you I've built more than a few Marshall Plexi clones (as well as other amps I've designed). I have a full work bench with all the test equipment necessary and then some (with a graduate level Electrical Engineering background). In my humble and honest opinion, the farthest from the original transformers, both power and output, are the Classic Tones and Mercurys; with the closets (of the ones I listed) being Heyboer.

That said, I will offer my opinion on the "closest" sounding (and acting) power and output transformers I've used; and those are the M E R R E N Audio trannys. NOTHING comes remotely close to them. From the construction, material, electrical / magnetic characteristics, reliability, frequency sweep, tonal color / character / reaction in sound; THEY ARE DEAD ON AMAZING!! (Good luck getting the T2562 from Chris ..... I was lucky enough to buy two a while back ). I've used his T2562 and his 1203-80 for a "Plexi" 100W (EVH type and the "normal" builds) with GREAT results. I'm very happy with them to say the least, and a great guy to deal with. Hope that helps ......Good luck in your build.

Ed

EddyInChicago wrote: (Good luck getting the T2562 from Chris .....
Ed

Why would you say that? I know a lot of guys are using Chris' trannies down in the basement.

Yeah, I have a T2562 and just got a 10,000 series 1203-80 from him a few months ago.

rgorke wrote:

EddyInChicago wrote: (Good luck getting the T2562 from Chris .....
Ed

Why would you say that? I know a lot of guys are using Chris' trannies down in the basement.

I say that guys because I've been in touch with Chris on a regular basis and have been told that he is having a hard time
acquiring the iron needed for his trannys. Someone I just communicated with infomed me, just last night, that he spoke to Chris recently (a couple days ago) and was told "a new batch" will be ready in 2-3 weeks. Chris did, or does, have the 1203-80 whenever I needed it. However, after he ran dry of the T2562, he has had problems getting the material. This is from my experience.

Ed

EddyInChicago wrote:

N3m0 7h3 Fi5h wrote:1. RACKSYSTEMS wrote:

Wow it's amazing what theory's can come about here. You want a transformer that does the sag the classic tone one does. Or the Marstran. The 100 watt amp I worked on was the amp on all the records. This is straight from Ed.

2. Roe wrote:

yes, the marstran 1203-80s and t2562s sag like the originals do (roughly 90v at full distortion). Its nice to hear that the classictone PTs also has the correct sag.


http://forum.metroamp.com/viewtopic.php ... 72#p402072" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I have personal experience with the following transformers; Mercury Mag, Classic Tone, Heyboer and a couple others, BUT NOT the Marstran. I can tell you that NON of the transformers sag like the original T2562 (or 1203-80 for that matter). I am not calling or implying Dave F. is a liar (please do not mis-understand). I'm only speaking from my experience and I can promise you I've built more than a few Marshall Plexi clones (as well as other amps I've designed). I have a full work bench with all the test equipment necessary and then some (with a graduate level Electrical Engineering background). In my humble and honest opinion, the farthest from the original transformers, both power and output, are the Classic Tones and Mercurys; with the closets (of the ones I listed) being Heyboer.

That said, I will offer my opinion on the "closest" sounding (and acting) power and output transformers I've used; and those are the M E R R E N Audio trannys. NOTHING comes remotely close to them. From the construction, material, electrical / magnetic characteristics, reliability, frequency sweep, tonal color / character / reaction in sound; THEY ARE DEAD ON AMAZING!! (Good luck getting the T2562 from Chris ..... I was lucky enough to buy two a while back ). I've used his T2562 and his 1203-80 for a "Plexi" 100W (EVH type and the "normal" builds) with GREAT results. I'm very happy with them to say the least, and a great guy to deal with. Hope that helps ......Good luck in your build.

Ed

Ed, I have been told the same thing about M E R R EN. I was told to go with them.

What is Dave F using for OTs? Is Marstran his go to?

Looking at both M E R R E N and Marstran right now. $170 isn't bad for the OT.. through Marstran. Not seeing prices on M E R R E N

EddyInChicago wrote:

rgorke wrote:

EddyInChicago wrote: (Good luck getting the T2562 from Chris .....
Ed

Why would you say that? I know a lot of guys are using Chris' trannies down in the basement.

I say that guys because I've been in touch with Chris on a regular basis and have been told that he is having a hard time
acquiring the iron needed for his trannys. Someone I just communicated with infomed me, just last night, that he spoke to Chris recently (a couple days ago) and was told "a new batch" will be ready in 2-3 weeks. Chris did, or does, have the 1203-80 whenever I needed it. However, after he ran dry of the T2562, he has had problems getting the material. This is from my experience.

Ed

Well thats good to know he's not just throwing some shit together and selling as is. Keeping with the original specs says a lot about how he feels about his product. The 1203-80 I got from him has a 2.5" stack and some old black bell cover on it. It looks like Darth Vaders helmet. He did say he had some C1998 OT's at the time I talked to him as well. I've never waited more than a day for him to get back to me either.

Well Classic Tones plexi laydown power on the bench was sagging exactly like the measurements I took off several 12 series amps. Please note all the amps had the same new filter caps. Chris's transformers are great also but I find them a bit more fat and classic sounding then more of the vh type thing. Marstran are also good. I use a custom output transformer from heyboer for my stuff. To each his own it's all a complete recipe. Sum of all the parts together.

I agree, I am more and more finding that out

RACKSYSTEMS wrote:Well Classic Tones plexi laydown power on the bench was sagging exactly like the measurements I took off several 12 series amps. Please note all the amps had the same new filter caps. Chris's transformers are great also but I find them a bit more fat and classic sounding then more of the vh type thing. Marstran are also good. I use a custom output transformer from heyboer for my stuff. To each his own it's all a complete recipe. Sum of all the parts together.

Thanks Dave, I will be checking out Classic Tone for sure.

Stupid question here. Does a 50 watt use a different Power Transformer than a 100 watt?

jnew wrote:Stupid question here. Does a 50 watt use a different Power Transformer than a 100 watt?

Yes

Hmm. OK.

jnew wrote:Stupid question here. Does a 50 watt use a different Power Transformer than a 100 watt?

Drake 1202-118