Trouble in the studio

Techniques for getting your tone to tape.

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demonufo
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Trouble in the studio

Post by demonufo » Fri Feb 26, 2010 3:29 pm

My 2204 is sounding pretty darned thin so far, using 1960TV cab with just 2 G12M-65's as a detuned cab.
The room is a big, dead sounding Iso room, and I'm not liking it one bit.
Struggling to stop my amp from sounding thin and scratchy.

I'm beginning to think the MM OT might have been a bad move, and that my amp actually does sound crap. Or is it likely to be just down to the room?

Must take my 4104 with me next time and experiment a little, and maybe my 18watter. Won't even bother with the Cornford. That ain't gonna cut it for me.

The other guitarist took his JCM900 (dual reverb) and ended up using the soundguys 100watt VHT head. Now I quite like the VHT CL head when I tried one a few years back, but to me, this one sounded even worse than the JCM900, but it was inducing grins with my bandmate, so it stuck.


Edit: Just had a minor thought. I really ought to take the castors off before I do anything rash I suppose! :oops:
Of course this might not fix much... :?

Edit: Another issue. Both mics are close (condenser and 57). Soundman says the room will cause phase problems when distance mic'ing. I trust him on this since he knows the room well, but I guess this isn't ideal. Any thoughts?
So I like purple, okay!!!!!!

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Re: Trouble in the studio

Post by zrAC/DC » Thu Apr 22, 2010 9:42 pm

I would try pulling back the condenser a bit and just get them in phase. I seem to get a fat sounding recording with a cheap condenser (studio projects) and nothing else on my speaker cab about 6 inches away in the center of the right bottom speaker with the front of the mic angled to the center of the speaker cab. I can manage a decent sound in my living room.

Just play around with mic placements, there is usually one spot that sounds far better than anything else. Also, I make sure I have a lot of volume coming out of the amp, I know some people say its better to have the amp quieted down for the studio, but I never have any luck with getting quiet amps to sound good.
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demonufo
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Re: Trouble in the studio

Post by demonufo » Sat Apr 24, 2010 5:51 pm

Managed to get it a little better. Ditched the 57 altogether. Can't believe I'm still finishing this thing. It's been real piecemeal. Like an hour and a half here and there.

I just know I'm not gonna be pleased with the results. :(
So I like purple, okay!!!!!!

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Re: Trouble in the studio

Post by motorhead_6 » Wed May 19, 2010 4:21 am

Can't say for you but I have found that for me a straight faced cabinet sounds better than a slant faced. I like the mic real close. I have a spot where I like it but I am not sure how to describe where that is in words. I have gotten really good sound for rythem tracks by running the amps master volume really quiet (barely on) but the pre-gain all the way up but that doesn't work too well for lead tracks. I have also gotten good sound (but different) for rythem by cranking it till my ears bled. Anywhere in between doesn't seem to work for me.

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Re: Trouble in the studio

Post by motorhead_6 » Wed May 19, 2010 4:24 am

On the room mic : I always thought that was a great idea and I have tried it and tried it but it never has worked for me. I am not sure if its because of phase cancellation but I think it likely is. It took years before I finally gave up on that.

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Re: Trouble in the studio

Post by motorhead_6 » Wed May 19, 2010 4:25 am

I meant using two mics. One close and one far (the room mic).

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Re: Trouble in the studio

Post by Obsolete » Wed Jul 10, 2013 4:30 pm

it shouldn't be rocketsurgery, something is amiss, sm7 into a 1073, done. once you have that down and it doesn't suck you have more freedom to get cute with it. maybe try a royer, grasping at straws for a tone is a shitty feeling, i hope it gets better for you.

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Re: Trouble in the studio

Post by Sral68 » Mon May 19, 2014 3:26 pm

I have been using two mics, one 57 and a 421. Both straight up in the grill.
This way I don't get any phase issues. The wave files are perfectly aligned.
You need to find the sweet spot. Start where the dust cap meets the cone. Move it to the side if its to bright.
This way you can balance the two mice till you get your sound.
If the sound is thin it could also be that the speakers in the cab aren't in phase.
The times I have recorded with a condenser a bit off phase has been a bitch. You need to move the mic til it sounds good.
Also Ive found that the 57 likes a bit of drive from the mic pre. Seems to tigthen it up.
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Re: Trouble in the studio

Post by redgtr » Mon May 19, 2014 9:20 pm

usually a thin sound is phase cancellation. since you are using two mics I would definitely think it was a phase issue. try moving mics back and forth (not left to right) or use the phase switch on the console, pro tools etc.

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Re: Trouble in the studio

Post by Ferrari-Dude » Mon May 19, 2014 9:46 pm

redgtr wrote:usually a thin sound is phase cancellation. since you are using two mics I would definitely think it was a phase issue.
I definitely agree that this sounds like a phase issue.

Does your studio have a Radial PhaseQ or other phase altering box? I'm not talking just a 0/180 degree switch but a true phase altering box. If so, run one of the mics through that and adjust phase until you get the most low end.
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Re: Trouble in the studio

Post by redgtr » Tue May 20, 2014 6:52 am

Ferrari-Dude wrote:
redgtr wrote:usually a thin sound is phase cancellation. since you are using two mics I would definitely think it was a phase issue.
I definitely agree that this sounds like a phase issue.

Does your studio have a Radial PhaseQ or other phase altering box? I'm not talking just a 0/180 degree switch but a true phase altering box. If so, run one of the mics through that and adjust phase until you get the most low end.
Yes! A variable phase would be a quick fix. The phase switch on a console or plugin is a fixed setting and will get you half way there

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