Metropoulos Forum

I can't even begin to digest everything, but I took notes. I'll post some of the tihngs we spoke about here. And I'll also update that MM vs Heyboer thread. Lots of info that applies to those observations.

Got some good insight on the Marshall Dagnall clone and stock RI OT too.




george

Dangle the carrot and leave us hanging, ya tease........

I just had this amazing conversation with Paul McCartney. He told me things that people would pay a million bucks to hear. Stuff about the other Beatles that would make you choke on your own spit and piss your pants. OMG it was the most amazing stuff youll ever hear. Ill post what he said at some point.

So what was the Sergio stuff...

Billy Batz wrote:I just had this amazing conversation with Paul McCartney. He told me things that people would pay a million bucks to hear. Stuff about the other Beatles that would make you choke on your own spit and piss your pants. OMG it was the most amazing stuff youll ever hear. Ill post what he said at some point.
So what was the Sergio stuff...

Sorry guys, point taken. I was just excited about the ingo and at the same time frustrated because I've had to f**k with this web s**t.

Sergio answered a lot of my questions about materials (steel, copper, paper, plastic ect) and how they affect tone. The origin of the O100JM.

Why MM only uses US mined, processed, anealed steel? Turns out they have top secret military contracts where they can ONLY use this stuff. Plus they have total control over how it's made. Not to mention it sounds better than any other steel on earth. So they use it for everything.

Copper too. Made in Indiana. 99.99% pure, oxygen free.

Tuning the PT to the amp. That's cool. Calculating the core characteristics- makes sense. Then you build it and some guy sits there with a hammer beating on it until it matches the specs on paper.

Many more, I'll post as I can.

VG

VelvetGeorge wrote:

Billy Batz wrote:I just had this amazing conversation with Paul McCartney. He told me things that people would pay a million bucks to hear. Stuff about the other Beatles that would make you choke on your own spit and piss your pants. OMG it was the most amazing stuff youll ever hear. Ill post what he said at some point.
So what was the Sergio stuff...

Sorry guys, point taken. I was just excited about the ingo and at the same time frustrated because I've had to f**k with this web s**t.

Im just kidding of coarse.

Not to mention it sounds better than any other steel on earth.

What is it that makes him sure of that?

I need that, keep it coming. You guys keep me honest.


Obviously his opinion on the steel. I didn't realize I quoted him exactly.

VG

Did he mention the difference between the 500v @ 250ma coming from his PT and the 500v @ 250ma coming out of any run of the mill Hammond? (Oh.. wait there is none! other than the $300 price difference)

Did he say why in the world they use steel as magnet wire? The qualities that steel magnet wire has are horrible compared to those of regular copper.

I also somehow very highly doubt that MM, a guitar transformer company, has secret military projects.

No offense intended, but I smell a **** load of hype being unloaded onto us by MM.

playazincs wrote:I also somehow very highly doubt that MM, a guitar transformer company, has secret military projects.

No offense intended, but I smell a **** load of hype being unloaded onto us.

He said military contracts not secret projects. The company I work for is contracted my the US military and do a lot of work at Letterkenney. Does that mean Im saying Im involved with secret military stuff? If I was 10 it might. But as an adult I understand it means that you either work on, for, or supply or are supplied by the US military.

As far as PT's. I tend to agree with you.

George works for the Secret Service..??? Wa.......? 007

Billy Batz wrote: He said military contracts not secret projects.

In the post it literally says: top secret military contracts

playazincs wrote:I also somehow very highly doubt that MM, a guitar transformer company, has secret military projects.

No offense intended, but I smell a **** load of hype being unloaded onto us.

No offense, but in your post it quite literally said "secret military projects" while the original poster said "contracts". If you're going to quote someone out of context, or incorrectly, you might want to get it right.

As for MM's involvement in other projects, it's occurred to me that a power tranny is a power tranny when you have a blueprint, or mechanical drawing/spec sheet/whatever, to build from.

Who's to tell MM that they can ONLY build guitar amp trannies and not some other trannies?

Sorry to have spured this contract / project thing, but the way I see it, a company is contracted to work on somthing (which can be called a project) for the military.

That was not the point of the post really.

Nobody can say that MM can only make guitar transformers. The whole point of that passage is that if the military is looking for a transformer supplier, I think that they would have selected a more know and experienced company, such as Stancor or Triad, with whom it has had contracts before.

playazincs wrote:Did he mention the difference between the 500v @ 250ma coming from his PT and the 500v @ 250ma coming out of any run of the mill Hammond? (Oh.. wait there is none! other than the $300 price difference)

Other than the price there might be another even huge difference between both PT's.

Depending on the used sheet metal's quality, the wire's diameters and the numbers of turns you can get out a PT with a very stiff behaviour, a softer reacting PT or even a very spongy PT.

And not only the amount and value of the filter caps, but also the behaviour of the PT (voltage drop across the primary and secondary, how early the core is running into saturation, aso.) can make your amp more or less compressive, or very tight and stiff, or very loose.

I don't know any transformer company on this planet, which still have the 'old style' M6 sheet metal. The actual one is 'physically regarded' much ~better~, but with it it's very hard or maybe impossible, to get the 'old behaviour' of i.e. the Dagnall PT's from the late 60'.

Maybe MM is the only company, who still have or can produce/get this type of sheet metal, maybe Heyboer also? I don't know!

I only can attest, that the MM 460 PT's 'behaviour' is coming damn close to the behaviour of an original old Dagnall PT from the late 60'.

Larry

novosibir wrote: Other than the price there might be another even huge difference between both PT's.

Depending on the used sheet metal's quality, the wire's diameters and the numbers of turns you can get out a PT with a very stiff behaviour, a softer reacting PT or even a very spongy PT.

And not only the amount and value of the filter caps, but also the behaviour of the PT (voltage drop across the primary and secondary, how early the core is running into saturation, aso.) can make your amp more or less compressive, or very tight and stiff, or very loose.

I don't know any transformer company on this planet, which still have the 'old style' M6 sheet metal. The actual one is 'physically regarded' much ~better~, but with it it's very hard or maybe impossible, to get the 'old behaviour' of i.e. the Dagnall PT's from the late 60'.

Maybe MM is the only company, who still have or can produce/get this type of sheet metal, maybe Heyboer also? I don't know!

I only can attest, that the MM 460 PT's 'behaviour' is coming damn close to the behaviour of an original old Dagnall PT from the late 60'.

Larry

Exactomundo ! The PT's play a HUGE part of "the magic tone"
[I personally prefer usuing all of what the PT has to offer runing at 16 ohms. I like the way it breathes. (personal preference ofcourse)]
Am I corect to say that, in a sense, this also applies to vintage Fender & Gibson pickups (without the voltage)?

My biggest fear is having to replace the PT. Sure as shit it's not like your changing the same watt light bulb. I think this has to be the biggest fear for everybody.

I had a discussion about this with friends earlier this year and I (we) agree whole heartedly with your statement Larry.

Were you sitting at the next table? ! ! !


Jimmie K.

novosibir wrote: "I don't know any transformer company on this planet, which still have the 'old style' M6 sheet metal. The actual one is 'physically regarded' much ~better~, but with it it's very hard or maybe impossible, to get the 'old behaviour' of i.e. the Dagnall PT's from the late 60'. "


Thats interesting, as I recently had 16 Kg's of M6 steel laminations under my desk - made at the mill here in the UK that supplies(d) Dagnall and Drake with their laminations since the early 60's. Linton & Hurst was the original name of the supplier to the afformentioned companies, but they went out of business a few years back. The mill is still producing the laminations to the exact same spec from the exact same ore suppliers as they did on the same machines 30 years ago...all in imperial measurements lol... We brits are ever so slow to change...which ~sometimes~ is a good thing.

Its beautiful stuff...heat treated and grain orientated....which is the opposite of what you want for the Outputs tx's.