You Vote: BOG EL34 vs. 6550

basile865 · Post by **basile865** » Sat Dec 13, 2008 7:00 pm

razel I think thats just him turning up the volume on the guitar.

Agreed Dan with most of what you said. Obviously the final verdict will come from buying everything and deciding based on that. I obviously can't do that for years to come so I dig through everybody. Germino's word is definitely not the final verdict. I have had the opportunity to play his work in person and was thoroughly pleased, so yes, I do have a strong respect for his opinions. But I also have the same for yours, as you have come quite close to BOG in your clips and you were the one who coached me into rippin that damn bright cap out! My amp would've been unusable otherwise. I know you feel like a broken record, I just like covering as much ground as I can, and opening up new thought processes from other skilled people to bring to the discussion here. Thats all. Had I just jumped at the first suggestion any body gave, I'd be out a lot of cash and not happy with my decision. So its slowly coming along.

As far as my views on superbass, its not just Greg Germino who describes them that way, its every review online that I read them described like that. Cleaner, rounder, better headroom, more bass response, etc.

After all this research I've come to find that I really dont care for the majority of hendrix's tone atleast in the sense of what I want to model mine after. It really is just his who knows clean sound that is exactly what I want. No news to everyone I know....

But theres no need to take offense or get angry about it, Im just saying hey guys somebody who has a educated opinion on the matter feels differently, heres something to think about....

Again, maybe only I'm the most interested in it and I'll keep things like it to myself as to not get these comments.

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Sat Dec 13, 2008 11:35 pm

After all this research I've come to find that I really dont care for the majority of hendrix's tone atleast in the sense of what I want to model mine after. It really is just his who knows clean sound that is exactly what I want. No news to everyone I know....

Well I can second that. Other then BoG and to a lesser degree a few other lone examples, Im really not a Hendrix tone ut believe it or not lol.

But theres no need to take offense or get angry about it, Im just saying hey guys somebody who has a educated opinion on the matter feels differently, heres something to think about....

No offense felt here. I just think its time to take a leap and get yourself to the next level otherwise you can rethink things to the point of Reductio ad absurdum. At some point a choice has to be made. Even if its an impulse that later turns out to be wrong- is it a waste of money? In one sense yeah but at least you know where your at. Thats true more than anything with 6550s. How many threads went up? Noone wants to throw away $100 but if it turns out to be a good thing would you care? And if you dont like it then you wont have to waste anymore time and energy on that subject.

Its too bad you dont live within some reasonable distance from me. Like I said before Id do the mods for you to try and you can try out my amps as much as you want. Super Bass, Super Lead, 67 JTM-100 w/EL34s, 66 JTM-45/100 w/KT66s, Fender Super etc.. Just plug em all in, turn em all on, and swap the speaker cord around. Not to mention a 120w vs 300w cab comparison.

basile865 · Post by **basile865** » Sat Dec 13, 2008 11:54 pm

totally agreed 100 percent. I think I just enjoy talking about it so much because since I'm broke, its some way of being involved still haha.

By the way, for whatever its worth, the germino amp I played was a club 40, which greg told me in a recent email is tuned to bass specs. If after installing the OT I still feel theres a little something lacking, bass specs is what I'd like to tune this amp to.

BOG or not, thats the route I'll go because that amp had a big great fatness to it unlike any amp I've ever played. Of course other components play a role in what made that club 40 sound so good, but now I have a better clue as to what the bass specs will be more like.

As far as speakers, no ground has been covered there yet, but god its hard to ignore the helltone 30 loaded avatar 4x12 for 500 bucks. 75hz yes but what a deal. Even if I need something fatter, I can get a second cab later and put 55hz in.

razelfrax · Post by **razelfrax** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 12:23 am

BB how do you like your h55s with a Strat ? What wattage are they?

jcs · Post by **jcs** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 2:55 am

get out there and plug into a bunch of different cabs,try some different strats as well..

in the case of the 75s in my 1984 jcm800 these are the ONLY 75s i have tried or heard that exhibited clarity/balance in tone.

i dont know when 75s evolved into the harsher stiffer speakers that i've encountered but i assume its around the later 80s.

celestion made slight changes to speakers all of the time thru the years.

jim at scumback will tell you how many prerola celestions he went thru to find good specimens to clone (100s).

if it were me, i would replace a pair at a time and sell the pulls to help fund the new speakers.

short of that do what i do, WORK MORE HOURS to make more money!!

Tone-Freak · Post by **Tone-Freak** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 10:05 am

Billy Batz wrote:
basile865 wrote:Man, it just flat out doesn't make any sense whatsoever that Jimi could plug into the high treble input and get his sound. Even without a bright cap at all its too thin, and god imagine with low output single coils, itd be flat out disgusting. It makes no sense!

And this is me saying that with my channels jumped and the normal vol off
Maybe it doesnt make sense but this one isnt an issue. Theres countelss pics to see for yourself. Its the top left input every time.

I plug into the top left and mine does not sound disgusting

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 10:13 am

razelfrax wrote:BB how do you like your h55s with a Strat ? What wattage are they?

I like them a lot. Theyre 30Wers. Ive been thinking of refitting the whole cab with 60Wers tho. Not for anything to do with this thread but I only have the one cab and only will ever have the one cab. Plus its a tad less high end Im told.

basile865 · Post by **basile865** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 11:02 am

man I'd work more hours if I could. Believe me the last thing I want to be doing is scrubbing treadmills down on my hands and knees after working hard for a degree. But a part time job at this gym is the only thing I could find after months of trying.

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 12:39 pm

Its not that hard to do a few simple mods to make your amp more like a bass:
Simple Mod 1 - The wire going from V1/Pin8; clip it from the board and solder it to pin3
Simple Mod 2 - Trace the wire from V2/pin3 to the board and simply remove the cap it goes to (.68u)

The other mods would require you to swap components on the board. Without getting into that the coupling caps will still be smaller values (blocking more lows) but overall the only other main mod would be the tone stack values. That probably has more to do with why Leads sound different then any other single mod (other then brite cap which you removed) but you now have shared V1 which adds in a lot of low end and you removed the bypass cap on V2 which removes a high/mid boost.

Another mod thats not necessarily stock, if you want to clean up the amp more, look at the impedance selector switch. There will be a purple wire on one of the terminals. Simply change it to the 16ohm terminal or move it to the output jacks' tip. Thats all.

basile865 · Post by **basile865** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 1:00 pm

thanks, Ive been considering making it shared cathode. All that involves is soldering pin 3 to pin 8 on v1 correct? Would I get shocked by doing that if I'm careful not to touch anything else?

Any certain gauge wire to use as well?

jcs · Post by **jcs** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 2:17 pm

drain that amp off first!

razelfrax · Post by **razelfrax** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 2:30 pm

Just get some alligator clip jumpers from circuit city or the like and clip one end to the chassis and one to pin 1 or 6 on v1 and youll be draining the b+ off with no sparks or shocks . No need to use an outboard resistor . Just got a package from a certain Amp company. Ive been scummed lol. Going to go to the studio tonight and let em rip.

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 2:32 pm

Yeah. Go to radio shack. Mini jumper cables. Jump Pin1 to the chassis. Wait a few minutes. Leave it there while you work. Dont forget to take it off before you put it back.

Actually a better way to do it if you want to be able to put it back stock very easily is just to heat pin 8 and remove the wire there. Tape it or heat shrink it so its out of the way. Then just use a little peice of wire- you can even just cut off one of the leads of a spare resistor or something- and jump pins 3 and 8.

texwest · Post by **texwest** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 3:28 pm

I read this whole thread today. And its fascinating. One thing I keep thinking about has never been mentioned. Hendrix's guitar was running thru a fuzz, univibe, octavia and wah. If these effects weren't modified to true bypass, they will suck alot of tone and highend out of the sound, especially the wah. I'm not an expert about these old effects and the tone draining effect of an old univibe or octavia. Most all my effects are true bypass. But I do know how badly some old effects, especially wahs, will suck your tone out. I've played for 30 years so I remember this quite well.

It seems to me that his tone would have been dramatically altered if they weren't modified. You would definitely want a bright amp after all those effects. I would really like to know what you guys think about all this.

this might really stir the pot!!! Thanks Dan and for all you guys doing this research

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 8:45 pm

Tex this isnt something that hasnt been discussed in the past just not here. What Ive read is the largest contributor would be vintage vibes. Even off the guitar goes through all the SS circuitry just without the wet side of the effect. The rest of them what it basically amounts to is the signal is still coupled to all the output pots and through them loaded to ground. But with 4 effects thats certainly an issue. It all adds up

Vintage strat with 60s pickups on the low side.
Loading down by 4 effects
Daisy chaining and how that kills the input signal
Cords that pass less 'voltage'

And thats all before the amp has any active say. Believe it or not Ive thought of taking the schematics of all those effects as well as a schematic of how 3 amps daisy chained would sum, then sum it all up and make a box that recreates that effect. Without a doubt it would clean up and warm up the signal. Basically it would be a complex low pass filter.

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