Fuzz experience

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daveweyer
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Re: Fuzz experience

Post by daveweyer » Tue Mar 24, 2015 5:03 pm

Just bare your soul on the forum!

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Re: Fuzz experience

Post by John_tucker66 » Thu Jul 09, 2015 2:16 pm

Image

So I've been toying with the blue jhf1 fuzz face by dunlop and have been gettin some good results. The first thing I tried was the input resistor. Started with 10k and it sounds awesome. Opens the tone up a little more and gives it some more clarity. I'll try a 20k next and see how each do with a wah in front. I've also tried hooking the leg of C3 directly to the collector or the Q2. That was interesting. It sounded more compressed with more gain on the output. But the tone wasn't great, or that close to a sustain machine like what has been discussed here and a few other threads. I'm still having to turn the fuzz up pretty high to get a strong enough signal.

Any suggestions Dave for more sustain? I've attached an image of the fuzz circuit. Thanks so much.

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Re: Fuzz experience

Post by daveweyer » Sun Jul 12, 2015 8:31 pm

For some reason I could only see a part of the circuit. Maybe you could put up an image with the whole thing--schematic would be great.

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Re: Fuzz experience

Post by John_tucker66 » Mon Jul 13, 2015 12:53 pm

Hey Dave, sorry about that, I can't seem to get a good pic up here. Actually Xplorer posted this same fuzz schematic on pg 49 of the west cost mods thread. Sorry for the redundancy with this fuzz too, I think it's just an easy fuzz to start modding on since you can get another one pretty easily.

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Re: Fuzz experience

Post by John_tucker66 » Mon Jul 13, 2015 12:55 pm

Xplorer wrote:here is the blue fuzz, i needed to have a look at it, for the input and output cap. apparently, with these particular bc108C transistors, it's a nice combination.

the 100k is decreased to 82k i see.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-M4RTvP2htXU/T ... _JH-F1.gif

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Re: Fuzz experience

Post by daveweyer » Mon Jul 13, 2015 10:19 pm

Well the gain of the circuit is pretty well controlled by the gain of the transistors. The overall output level can be increased by doing what you did, take the output cap closer to the collector of Q2. This overdrives the input stage of the amp more, or whatever you've got after the FF, hence the compression effect. It really doesn't change the tone of the circuit itself.
Higher beta input transistors are probably the best option--to see if it takes you where you want to go. Since this is an NPN silicon circuit, there are lots of choices. Seems like folks have tried quite a few different devices in this circuit, with quite varied results.
The more gain the thing has without total distortion, the more the apparent sustain will be. Sustain is affected in a major way by the compression in the circuit. Feedback of select frequencies into the guitar pickup is another big factor in sustain. A compressor, with no distortion, can add a lot of sustain, or harmonic feedback into the guitar with no distortion can add a lot of sustain. Distortion accentuates certain frequencies to get the positive regeneration going between the amp and guitar. A balance of both phenomena can get the most sustain--which doesn't have to be indecipherable mush to make it work.
Try different transistors, the collector resistor on Q2 should be variable so you can bring the output cap as close to the collector of Q2 as you need to make it sound good. Also vary the input resistor. Between the three things you'll get a lot of variation.

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Froumy
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Re: Fuzz experience

Post by Froumy » Sat Sep 12, 2015 11:55 am

You guys all get a BIG drop in high end, with the guitar volume on 10? (JHF1) Have to roll of the vol to get my high end back. No other pedals.

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Re: Fuzz experience

Post by Tek465b » Sat Sep 12, 2015 3:35 pm

Froumy wrote:You guys all get a BIG drop in high end, with the guitar volume on 10? (JHF1) Have to roll of the vol to get my high end back. No other pedals.
Nope, not for me with most FF.

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Re: Fuzz experience

Post by Froumy » Sat Sep 12, 2015 8:43 pm

BAHH! Killing my high end.

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Re: Fuzz experience

Post by Xplorer » Sat Sep 12, 2015 9:13 pm

it does kill a bit the high end indeed, and that's interesting if you're after some specific bog tones.
but what you need, to adjust this a bit, is an input bias pot or trimer.

on the opposite, when the fuzz gain is at 10, ( and the volume down to 3 maybe ) you get the high ends back, while with the fuzz gain down to 8 - 9, you're still in high end killed territory.

but you can managa some interesting things thanks to this actualy.

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Re: Fuzz experience

Post by daveweyer » Tue Sep 15, 2015 10:04 pm

One of the reasons the highs roll off when the fuzz control is turned down is because that's when the most negative feedback is delivered to the base of the input transistor; if the overall response of the fuzz circuit accentuates the highs when there is no feedback (fuzz maximum), then when there is feedback, it will roll off the highs since it will have an out-of-phase signal with more highs than lows, essentially subtracting the highs from the input signal.
The way to fix this is to make the fuzz circuit flat when it is run with no feedback; make sure the highs and lows are equal. Then when the output signal is fed back to the input node, it will lower the volume of both highs and lows equally.

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C J H
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Re: Fuzz experience

Post by C J H » Sat Nov 21, 2015 7:20 pm

A little story from CJH's diary..

.. Yesterday i got into messing with my Fuzz-pedals again and revived my interest in Dave's 3-transistor design, big time. After listening to shakti's clip of that Castledine fuzz with 3 transistors again my 'need' got even worse.. Don't have the parts or the time to build one up right now so I had another idea: I have this Dunlop Octavio, the "jimi reissue" in the cool grey casing. It's a good sounding pedal and the inside looks neater than most other dunlop products I've owned before.. I wondered if one could somehow add a switch so the octave-circuit could be disabled and one would get pure fuzz?

Well, walked into my local music store on my way to the bus, tried out another fuzz (built on the same idea) on the store-owners recommendation.. liked what it did so I bought a mini-switch and went home. The bus took over an hour, got the first snow for the winter in the south of Sweden today and it has the same effect every year.. everything just stops dead in its tracks, especially traffic. Anyway.. when I got home I was hungry so I prepped some porkroast and put it in the oven. While waiting I started fiddling with the pedal. Added the switch so it switches one of the diodes following the transformer in/out of the circuit. Worked like a charm so I went out to the garage, drilled the casing and mounted the switch permanently -- all before dinner was done!

So now I've been playing all night and I have a new addiction: 3 transistor fuzzes. This one will keep me set until I get the time to put one together from schratch. Think I will use those nifty little jacks that lets you slide the transistors in/out easily -- awesome for experimenting!?

Miced up reaaally quickly for the first little jam and made a quick cut of some snippets to showcase the sound of this thing. You hear me strumming through just the amp first, then engage the vibe and then the fuzz -- it stays on through the clip from that point and is controlled only with guitar vol/attack. Amp is the JTM100 I weyer'ized.

clip of fuzz
https://soundcloud.com/pippo1448/o-fuzz

clip of octavefuzz (stock pedal, through another amp though...)
https://soundcloud.com/pippo1448/all-al ... rnate-take



Time for bed! Good night
Jake
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Xplorer
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Re: Fuzz experience

Post by Xplorer » Sat Nov 21, 2015 8:44 pm

oh so you're in sweeden ? i like this country ;)

your clips are great, the AATWT alternate version sounds fantastic, did you do the slide parts too ? it sounds fabulous.

i think i personnaly prefer the axis fuzz three transistors over this Dunlop fuzz, but i should hear it again.
did you test the axis with this amp ?

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C J H
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Re: Fuzz experience

Post by C J H » Sun Nov 22, 2015 1:52 pm

Yup, born and raised! France ain't too shabby either ;)

Thanks, the regular slide part is on the backingtrack, I did the 'ambient' slide over it, the clean (verse) 'leady' rhytm and the octavefuzz parts.

Built another Fuzz today.. or finally got around to modding my vintage one (the one I used on my older clips from when I first joined in on these discussions. It is now done up like an 'always on' like we discussed ages ago.. one set fuzz (pretty much full on) switchable to a adjustable (which I set cleaner). Now running bc108s instead of 109s.. Sounds more open than the octavio's fuzz, more 'space for other sound' than fuzz -- more woody if you will. Still with adjustable Bias. Very interesting results and different from just cleaning up using guitar volume, expecially when driving a Vibe.

About the axis fuzz: yup this is the amp I did clips with when using the axis as well. I gotta say I'm not that impressed, it just sounds dead and stiff in comparison to the other 2.. Which is weird since I loved the Axis when I got it and for years after. It's one of those rocketships by RM himself so I might build another one from scratch and see where I end up. Got some parts and stuff coming this week so I can keep busy over christmas.. among other things an experimental platform based on the 3 transistor Fuzz will be put together. I feel that the amp is sorted, might try high filtering and will try a quad of 6ca7's but the base is just the way I want it now. That means it is time to get to the bottom of the fuzz's, hehe...

Will get back with some clips of the 'always on'-fuzz later!
:jimi:
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Xplorer
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Re: Fuzz experience

Post by Xplorer » Wed Nov 25, 2015 10:37 pm

so you're an always on fuzz addict ! he he

i like it too, but i don't use it much recently, i don't know why, maybe because indeed, the axis has some potential but it's missing something alive in it, hard to describe.
Still with adjustable Bias. Very interesting results and different from just cleaning up using guitar volume, expecially when driving a Vibe.
exactly, totaly different from playing the strat volume ... after all it's 3 tubes ( transistors ) before V1 , V2, V3 ... if we can put it that way.

yes please, let us know how it sounds, maybe with clips, once you put some 6Ca7 into an SL.
it's perfectly believable that in the us, if Jimi didn't have el34, some techs, including Dave, replaced them with 6ca7, and it maye explain some sounds from 67 , 68 ...

another thing : does anybody have some gold lace sensors pickups ? i prefer these more than the 69 pickups, you should try.
69's deserve their reputation, glassy. it's nice but not everytime.

if i could i'd love to do some feedbacks and sustains with a fuzz, but i now tend to add a bit of fuzz gain too, cause the volume alone may sometimes lack of smoothness.

i too should be busy with builds. i'll make a perfect univibe replica, early model.

looking forward to hear your new clips ! :toast:

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