Ed's Franky (beneath the paint)

rdodson · Post by **rdodson** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 4:52 pm

Tone Slinger wrote:Thanks for posting this Bill, great find

Its really an anomolly (Ed's Franky). I'm having a hard time getting used to playing anything else other than my KNE Azusa Franky clone. The countours and the way the neck sits up just a hair higher in the neck pocket are preferable for me, as compared to a fender strat.

That shallower neck pocket was a feature of the '54 Fender Strats, which meant they had a more acute break angle at the bridge if the bridge was set up in a non-floating manner. Better snap and sustain. See not only EVH, but Eric Johnson from the days he played his famous '54, Virginia.

Tone Slinger · Post by **Tone Slinger** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 5:11 pm

Cool info Ron, I wasn't aware of that

. At first with this KNE of mine, I couldn't quite get the saddles high enough. I found longer screws for the saddles (the D&G specifically) and it worked out fine. I got 6105 frets. The tiny vintage frets of vintage Fenders make a shallow neck pocket/ vintage tremolo combo no problem......its large frets that can cause a problem when using a vintage style tremolo. I took the saddle screws out of a Gotoh traditional 6 screw tremolo and put'em in my old Tokai tremolo's.

garbeaj · Post by **garbeaj** » Sat Aug 01, 2015 7:16 am

Holy shit Bill! That is an incredible picture! I've been super busy at work and with my baby girl at home and I just saw this at 3:00 am after waking up to change and feed the baby...WOW! This is incredible...this is the only color shot that I have seen of the "two-knob" Frankenstein...the earliest known incarnation of the painted version of the black and white Frankenstein. Shortly after the unfinished picture that this thread is about and before the well known first album cover and other early black and white Frankenstein pictures. This is also further circumstantial evidence to my theory that the Destroyer was in it's white painted phase for the recording of the first album. God knows I've done exhaustive research on that!

There was a black and white picture that shows the two knobs from an L.A. area rock fanzine that was also used on some of the band's flyers back in the day. This pic was the only pic of the Frankenstein with two knobs and it was only in black and white...this incredible COLOR pic is proof that the guitar did indeed sport two knobs shortly after it was painted. The fanzine shot was a little blurry in that area, but this one is pretty clear. This is impossibly rare...did you share this with Greg Renoff?! It is a shame that this pic won't be in his book. The origin of the extra "hole" in the black pickguard is pretty evident now!

Wow, I'm totally blown away by this pic (in case you hadn't noticed!)...that crazy lap-steel type guitar that Dave is playing is insane...I wonder if this was an early performance of "Ice Cream Man"?! WOW!!!

Tone Slinger · Post by **Tone Slinger** » Sat Aug 01, 2015 8:15 am

Upon further research in 'eyeing' the grain line/ring growth, I have concluded that Ed's Franky is joined with the 'A' seam. Judging by the distance from each ring, the growth of both pieces is from good growth (not real tight/ close togather ring lines). This indicates medium weight ash indeed. Say 4 1/2 lb body.

wjamflan · Post by **wjamflan** » Sat Aug 01, 2015 10:00 am

Thanks guys. I've been pretty busy this summer too, but when I saw the pic with the date I knew some here would like it. I have 20 Kat Hanes/VH pictures that have been posted over the years. She and her friends seem to have been friends with the band and present at a lot of the early gigs. I believe Kat has a scrapbook of those times and occasionally posts pics from it. Here's her and two friends (cousins Kym and Patti) in 1976 that show up in a bunch of the pictures-Kat is on the left:

wjamflan · Post by **wjamflan** » Sat Aug 01, 2015 10:05 am

Allen - we also have this well known pic of Franky with two knobs - supposedly at the Whisky in 1977 - that I know I've seen here before:

wjamflan · Post by **wjamflan** » Sat Aug 01, 2015 10:07 am

Here's another one that Kat took at the Whisky in 1977 that doesn't have an exact date but could be from the same night or time:

wjamflan · Post by **wjamflan** » Sat Aug 01, 2015 10:40 am

For me, there are two important points that come from the dated Magic Mountain picture:

1. If Franky had two knobs two weeks before recording started, it's at least possible it did on VH I as well.

2. If the picture is from the same gig that we have a boot of - I think it has to be - then we have actual proof of how Franky sounded with two knobs. On that point, I've said here before that the Magic Mountain boot and Pasadena Civic boot (10/15/77 after recording) are the only ones where we clearly hear the same tone that's on the album. It's somewhat present on the 6/10/77 Whisky boot, but the recording is not as good.

As far as the Magic Mountain boot goes.... here's the setlist of songs we have:

On Fire 4:57
One More Time 4:12
Running With The Devil 4:05
Atomic Punk 3:06
Ain't Talking 'Bout Love 4:37
Loss Of Control 3:47
Show No Mercy 3:54
Eruption 2:44
Feel Your Love Tonight 4:06
Show Your Love (I'm The One) 4:32
Summertime Blues 6:00

There are two places in the recording where other songs could have been played: after Show No Mercy and after FYLT. I'm not saying they were, but the transition from those songs is quick with no talking, and DLR introduced everything. That being said, the band could have played another set that included Ice Cream Man where DLR would have used that funky guitar. We just don't have the audio evidence. FWIW, the audio for Summertime Blues is not as good as the rest of the show, so maybe there were recording issues. Either way, it is exciting to have a new piece to the puzzle that just might not have been how we have thought all these years...

garbeaj · Post by **garbeaj** » Sat Aug 01, 2015 2:49 pm

wjamflan wrote:Allen - we also have this well known pic of Franky with two knobs - supposedly at the Whisky in 1977 - that I know I've seen here before:

I forgot that this one also showed the two knobs...

Interesting to think that the second knob could have been there during the recording. But Ed has said umpteen times that he couldn't figure out how to wire the tone knob so the second knob could have been a dummy knob. But who knows...maybe there was some magic mojo in the second knob.

Or maybe it was down to Ed studying Eric Clapton's live Cream playing:)

Strat78 · Post by **Strat78** » Mon Aug 03, 2015 1:16 pm

The Magic Mountain version of On Fire is played using the pre-VHI arrangement:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WXyN_7oNubc
So we are saying that the MM gig was after or before the recording of VHI. I remember hearing that On Fire was the first song they recorded during that session, what ever that is worth.

rgorke · Post by **rgorke** » Mon Aug 03, 2015 1:42 pm

wjamflan wrote:Allen - we also have this well known pic of Franky with two knobs - supposedly at the Whisky in 1977 - that I know I've seen here before:

What's weird is that I never recall us discussing the two knobs from this picture. we (or at least I) was obsessed with looking at the amps and Ed's funny shoes. The two knobs are clear as day.

If I would have to guess, I would say it probably isn't hooked up since he stated that he didn't know how. But then again, maybe it is.

fivecoyote · Post by **fivecoyote** » Mon Aug 03, 2015 3:30 pm

What is it with Ed and phantom white knobs? Did they all say "tone?"

wjamflan · Post by **wjamflan** » Tue Aug 04, 2015 8:08 am

Strat78 wrote:The Magic Mountain version of On Fire is played using the pre-VHI arrangement:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WXyN_7oNubc
So we are saying that the MM gig was after or before the recording of VHI. I remember hearing that On Fire was the first song they recorded during that session, what ever that is worth.

I'm saying that the above version of On Fire was recorded (8/15/77) around two weeks before VH I (8/29/77).

The VH I recording date comes from the Bud Scoppa article posted here a while back: Sunset Sound – 50 Years of Studio Magic. In it Scoppa states: “The studio log also shows that Van Halen began work on their first album with producer Ted Templeman on Aug. 29, 1977.”

Ain't Talkin' 'Bout Love also has a very different arrangement at MM than what shows up on the album, so Ted has clearly not begun to re-arrange the tunes.

Of course, all of these points will be fleshed out in Greg's Van Halen Rising.

The big news for us in the picture is the state of his guitars at that point in time, especially the tone knob on Franky. My question is: if the tone knob was disengaged, why would he yank it out of there before the 1st tour?

wjamflan · Post by **wjamflan** » Tue Aug 04, 2015 8:13 am

While I'm at it.... here's the best pic I have of Ed with Franky at the Pasadena Civic (10/15/77 I believe). I scanned it from an Inside magazine Club Days issue. What do you see?

wjamflan · Post by **wjamflan** » Tue Aug 04, 2015 8:15 am

Here's a closeup:

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