I cried today. I can't help it, I need to share this story.

[Bluesgeetar]

If I offend anyone I deeply apologize but here goes.

The meanest most dishonest, evil, back stabbing, lying, insecure, murderous, mental health challenged folks I have ever met or not met in my life were so called Devout church going bible toting Christians. I consider myself a christian but I refuse to go to church or socialize with the rest due to their enormous hypocrisy and evil ways. I worship in my own way and I am pretty happy and feel alot better in my method.

Sorry if I offended.

[Star*Guitar]

Your first mistake was believing anything posted on MSNBC.

They are run by the NBC news network and have entered into an agreement to work closely with the New York Time...both are the most liberal news organizations on the planet and they WILL...deceive you to further their own agenda. Can anyone say Propaganda???????

What ever happened to just reporting the news??

Sorry my friend...but most of the public is taking pounding by news organizations. The masses are being brainwashed and being told what to think. It is freakin scary...The press is the real power in America...they do program the thoughts of the masses. If you don't think so then you are naive.

It is no mistake that some of the largest corporations in America...(I.e..General Electric) own the major news organizations.

Yes... we really are no longer a democracy in a sense. We are run by powerful Corporations to further profit, the bottom line...and we are programed by subliminal brainwashing. A constant barrage of slanted new to contour public opinion.

Neutral news is a thing of the past.

[St August]

As fucked up as it is the USA is still the best place to live!

On another note not even one of the greatest civilizations in history (Rome) eventually fell. Is that where we are headed?

I agree and I dont think changing admins is going to make much difference
our socity is based on "Greed" so if your a republican or a democrat
is really doesnt matter.. The corruption of our government is the problem..
We need all new Members and the old ones have to go..We need to do our part and Vote them all out of office .. Listen to the guys that dont have all the money for TV adds.. But youll have to work at it.. Dont pick someone because of party pick them because there the right person for the Job..
Lets get some everyday people in there and not just the Lawyers and lifetime
government employees.. Just my .02

[NY Chief]

As fucked up as it is the USA is still the best place to live!

On another note not even one of the greatest civilizations in history (Rome) eventually fell. Is that where we are headed?

I agree and I dont think changing admins is going to make much difference
our socity is based on "Greed" so if your a republican or a democrat
is really doesnt matter.. The corruption of our government is the problem..
We need all new Members and the old ones have to go..We need to do our part and Vote them all out of office .. Listen to the guys that dont have all the money for TV adds.. But youll have to work at it.. Dont pick someone because of party pick them because there the right person for the Job..
Lets get some everyday people in there and not just the Lawyers and lifetime
government employees.. Just my .02

+1, Jerry.

My Mom, God rest her soul, had no clue as to politics but she sure had the right take. She always said " The Dems are a bunch of sex fiends and the Rep's are all crooks". Pretty right on in my book. Both parties suck.

Add to that the dumbing down of the country and the lifers in politics have us just where they want us.

[Flames1950]

As fucked up as it is the USA is still the best place to live!

On another note not even one of the greatest civilizations in history (Rome) eventually fell. Is that where we are headed?

I agree and I dont think changing admins is going to make much difference
our socity is based on "Greed" so if your a republican or a democrat
is really doesnt matter.. The corruption of our government is the problem..
We need all new Members and the old ones have to go..We need to do our part and Vote them all out of office .. Listen to the guys that dont have all the money for TV adds.. But youll have to work at it.. Dont pick someone because of party pick them because there the right person for the Job..
Lets get some everyday people in there and not just the Lawyers and lifetime
government employees.. Just my .02

I'll second that as well. Vote for the newbies who are running for the first time, who aren't yet involved in corporate agendas, who aren't in someone else's back pocket, and who still think like real living American people in the trenches. And be smart enough to vote them out when they've been bought after a few years.
Lifetime politicians are there to line their wallets, not yours. And the celebrities who support them have no clue as to what life for the average Joe is all about, so don't buy their line of bull either -- their wallets are pretty fat too ya know.........

[zaphod777]

St August wrote:
NY Chief wrote:
As fucked up as it is the USA is still the best place to live!

On another note not even one of the greatest civilizations in history (Rome) eventually fell. Is that where we are headed?


I agree and I dont think changing admins is going to make much difference
our socity is based on "Greed" so if your a republican or a democrat
is really doesnt matter.. The corruption of our government is the problem..
We need all new Members and the old ones have to go..We need to do our part and Vote them all out of office .. Listen to the guys that dont have all the money for TV adds.. But youll have to work at it.. Dont pick someone because of party pick them because there the right person for the Job..
Lets get some everyday people in there and not just the Lawyers and lifetime
government employees.. Just my .02


I'll second that as well. Vote for the newbies who are running for the first time, who aren't yet involved in corporate agendas, who aren't in someone else's back pocket, and who still think like real living American people in the trenches. And be smart enough to vote them out when they've been bought after a few years.
Lifetime politicians are there to line their wallets, not yours. And the celebrities who support them have no clue as to what life for the average Joe is all about, so don't buy their line of bull either -- their wallets are pretty fat too ya know.........

Nice +100,000

Which "god"? The "good, moral teachers" or the one God who created us? If you were raised Christian and are a believer, you know that "God exists in at least 95% of the world's religions" is not really true.

zaphod777 wrote:
Christians do not own God, Morals, or Marriage. These ideas are universal.

Marriage IS a Christian practice. There are similar practices in other religions but it's NOT the same thing.

What can I say, I Disagree Completely. Prove it? Any of it???
but,
I have no desire to try and Reason with you. Religion and Reason, don't mix.

[chad]

Your first mistake was believing anything posted on MSNBC.

They are run by the NBC news network and have entered into an agreement to work closely with the New York Time...both are the most liberal news organizations on the planet and they WILL...deceive you to further their own agenda. Can anyone say Propaganda???????

What ever happened to just reporting the news??

Sorry my friend...but most of the public is taking pounding by news organizations. The masses are being brainwashed and being told what to think. It is freakin scary...The press is the real power in America...they do program the thoughts of the masses. If you don't think so then you are naive.

It is no mistake that some of the largest corporations in America...(I.e..General Electric) own the major news organizations.

Yes... we really are no longer a democracy in a sense. We are run by powerful Corporations to further profit, the bottom line...and we are programed by subliminal brainwashing. A constant barrage of slanted new to contour public opinion.

Neutral news is a thing of the past.

I could not agree more.VERY WELL SAID Star*Guitar !! My thought's exactly. Chad

[toner]

Which "god"? The "good, moral teachers" or the one God who created us? If you were raised Christian and are a believer, you know that "God exists in at least 95% of the world's religions" is not really true.

zaphod777 wrote:
Christians do not own God, Morals, or Marriage. These ideas are universal.

Marriage IS a Christian practice. There are similar practices in other religions but it's NOT the same thing.

What can I say, I Disagree Completely. Prove it? Any of it???
but,
I have no desire to try and Reason with you. Religion and Reason, don't mix.

Faith is definitely involved. I totally understand your religion/reason comment. People (not necessarily you) who rely entirely on reason or intellect usually go with the Darwin evolution school of thought (even though modern science has "proved" it to be very flawed). On the other hand, there are hundreds of prophecies in the Bible that actually happened hundreds of years later. I consider these to be a type of proof.

One way I try to view Christianity from a "real world perspective" is to think of it like this:
Do you believe that George Washington really existed and did the things that were recorded in history? If so, there is way more historical evidence and eyewitness accounts of Christ's existence and the things that He did.

I don't expect you to trust me. Do some independent research of your own. Anyway, I've taken this way off-topic and I apologize for that.

[RattleCat]

"I would agree with that. We have strayed very far from our founding father's visions...

I'm going to go out on a limb here. I don't want to start a religion argument. There's enough of that in the world. However, the fact is that America was founded by people with strong Christian beliefs and values. Yet, our government has gradually tried to "ban" Christianity. It's ironic that church and state are separated but our Constitution is full of Christian beliefs and our currency has "In God We Trust" printed on it. Okay, enough of that"/[quote]



Sorry, not to get into a religious argument, and at best its a political argument. I mean no disrespect but feel compelled to reply. Christian beliefs and values are shared by many dogmas. To consider this country to be founded on Christianity is a misguieded notion. Many of our forefathers were masons you know.

And I don't mean to rile the forum up to much, and feel free to shut me down here, but it seems the modern U.S. has more in common with fascism than anything else.

[zaphod777]

Faith is definitely involved. I totally understand your religion/reason comment. People (not necessarily you) who rely entirely on reason or intellect usually go with the Darwin evolution school of thought (even though modern science has "proved" it to be very flawed). On the other hand, there are hundreds of prophecies in the Bible that actually happened hundreds of years later. I consider these to be a type of proof.

Evolution and biblical prophecy, we could debate these for years,
but, this isn't the place and neither of us is likely interested in expending that kind of energy.

One way I try to view Christianity from a "real world perspective" is to think of it like this:
Do you believe that George Washington really existed and did the things that were recorded in history?

I believe history is always influenced by those people writing it down/and/or fabricating it later on.
OR another way to look at it, " History is written by the winner"

I believe Washington existed, was he all the things that we have made him out to be? Not likely. Did he help found this country? very likely. Has research shown some of the myth's we created about Washington to not be true. Yes.

If so, there is way more historical evidence and eyewitness accounts of Christ's existence and the things that He did.

The same can be said for
Buddha(Buddhism), Mirza Husayn-'Ali-i-Nuri(Baha'i Faith), K'ung Fu Tzu (Confucianism), Muhammad (Islam), Shri Guru Nanak Dev Ji (Sikhism)
and on and on.

Do some independent research of your own

I have read a GREAT deal of philosophy/religion over the years.

I have no problem with anyone practicing the faith of there choice, in there OWN life.

I support the separation of church and state,
I dont want government involved in religion, in any form.
and
I dont want religion using government to spread there dogma, in any form