Tremolo Picking Analysis

[rgalpin]

Pretty interesting analysis I'd say...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C40Sj2u ... e=youtu.be


Really attempting to break down the technique into its individual components.

[motrock]

Yeah, this is going to take some getting used to... if ever! LOL Might have to use a thinner pick after.

In the Jimmy Kimmel video Ed is using 10 gauge for the Low E and 9 gauge for the High E. Combo set!

[Star*Guitar]

Super!! Im glad we are delving more into his technique. The way he holds the pick, the unorthodox approach is so outside the box and yet so perfect. It's part of his genius.

[garbeaj]

One thing that Troy pointed out on this that I never considered before is the pick angle.

You actually get a much better view of Ed's tremolo picking technique on the Live Without A Net video...I don't know why Troy chose to use the footage from the Kimmel show, other than that it is HD footage. Ed makes a real mess of the Kreutzer Étude melody here...the left hand just misses most of the notes!

Obviously Troy doesn't really know what Ed is doing, so he offers a free lesson to anyone that makes a video demonstrating and explaining what exactly Ed is doing. Honestly, if you just read wjamflan's description of the "so-so" motion of Ed's wrist and the hand positioning, you will have the best understanding of how Ed does it.

I have my own natural tremolo picking technique that has always come to me easily without any thought or effort, so I never really tried to imitate the "hummingbird/fan" picking and the "so-so" wrist motion as Bill describes it. I may work on it and make a clip to send in to Troy...I'd love a free lesson! His videos are very well done, probably the best instructional rock guitar videos ever made IMHO. It will take a lot of practice to try to ignore what I do naturally in order to imitate Ed's motion and pick angle, but it might be fun.

[mr.twistyneck]

It is just about the funnest technique ever. It still turns heads. You can just blaze away and lazily chew bubblegum at the same time. Absolutely correct that angle can help get you going.

This is what I posted on Troy's video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XTkRuQxDx4 Also called hummingbird picking, butterfly picking. it can be done at most any angle, but angling the pick can help get you going a little quicker. it can be done with thin or thick picks. The first step is to get the rotation down. Think of reaching out and turning a doorknob - that's the basic maneuver. Then grab a pick and do that rotation in the air. If it is easier to hold between your index and thumb, do that at first, and if you get that down and wish to try holding the pick between your middle and thumb, try that as well. There are very subtle differences that you can hear depending on your grip and angle. Starting with an upstroke seems to me to be the easiest, but it can be started with a downstroke as well. It is also fun to try and harness this style and control it in short stutters like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cUrs9151rGw. It is a really fun technique to play around with and add to your arsenal! Also, you can do this on mandolin or most any other stringed instrument. like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y004bCTVrEM

[rgalpin]

Best demo of anything. Ever.

And... one must admire the finger cheese on the neck. Twisty, you and I might be related some how - that guitar looks like every guitar I ever tried to love and care for!

You know what's fun to see is how (and I do this too) you get the motion started before you approach the strings. It's like starting the little motor and THEN putting it in the water.

[mr.twistyneck]

yep, that's a good analogy! I'm working on getting instantaneous start - requires a lot of practice. usually this is how it goes for me:

1. have no idea how to do it
2. learn how to do it the wrong way
3. 25 years later learn how to do it the right way

[rgalpin]

for the longest time i could not get the motion to happen when my arm was positioned so that the pick was contacting the string - i could do it in mid-air all day long and as soon as i got near the strings it blew up - never did figure out if that was mental or physical.

i used to practice on the steering wheel while driving - on the edge of the desk at work - the banister in the foyer - LOL! there's a spanish fly reference in here somewhere but i don't know how to get at it without ruining my formerly stained reputation.

[rdodson]

One thing that Troy pointed out on this that I never considered before is the pick angle.

You actually get a much better view of Ed's tremolo picking technique on the Live Without A Net video...I don't know why Troy chose to use the footage from the Kimmel show, other than that it is HD footage. Ed makes a real mess of the Kreutzer Étude melody here...the left hand just misses most of the notes!

Obviously Troy doesn't really know what Ed is doing, so he offers a free lesson to anyone that makes a video demonstrating and explaining what exactly Ed is doing. Honestly, if you just read wjamflan's description of the "so-so" motion of Ed's wrist and the hand positioning, you will have the best understanding of how Ed does it.

I have my own natural tremolo picking technique that has always come to me easily without any thought or effort, so I never really tried to imitate the "hummingbird/fan" picking and the "so-so" wrist motion as Bill describes it. I may work on it and make a clip to send in to Troy...I'd love a free lesson! His videos are very well done, probably the best instructional rock guitar videos ever made IMHO. It will take a lot of practice to try to ignore what I do naturally in order to imitate Ed's motion and pick angle, but it might be fun.

Troy's whole series is worth watching. Done on the level (or better) than the stuff on the Discovery Channel.

[Megaro]

Great thread !

Question: When I "anchor" part of my forearm on the body, I get a more consistent tremolo picking, but it really binds up my wrist in that position and I can't keep up the hummingbird motion for more than a few measures. But when I remove my arm entirely from the body, my wrist is much more comfortable, but my tremolo picking is very inconsistent and just plain old not very good.

Any advice ?

[rgorke]

Great thread !

Question: When I "anchor" part of my forearm on the body, I get a more consistent tremolo picking, but it really binds up my wrist in that position and I can't keep up the hummingbird motion for more than a few measures. But when I remove my arm entirely from the body, my wrist is much more comfortable, but my tremolo picking is very inconsistent and just plain old not very good.

Any advice ?

Not sure what you mean by "binds up"? Sounds like you have the right technique but just need to build up strength and endurance to do it longer.

[mr.twistyneck]

Question: When I "anchor" part of my forearm on the body, I get a more consistent tremolo picking, but it really binds up my wrist in that position and I can't keep up the hummingbird motion for more than a few measures. But when I remove my arm entirely from the body, my wrist is much more comfortable, but my tremolo picking is very inconsistent and just plain old not very good.

Great question! This technique is very much tied to your physical makeup - how big your fingers, hands and forearm are, the flexibility of your joints, etc. So the first thing to remember is: If you can make it sound good, don't worry about what it looks like. I looked at my video and think "dawwwwww wook at dose teeny tiny paws and short stubby arms on da elf". However, when I get that butterfly going at top speed it sounds great, so I don't really care.

Secondly, look at your forearm length. If you have a short forearm and anchor your elbow, then you'll be more over the strings, like me, with an angled pick attack. If you have longer forearms, then anchoring your elbow will mean that your hand will be further past the high E string, and you'll have to bend your wrist more inwards, maybe even come in from the bottom. If you feel your wrist binding or cramping, or affecting the butterfly motion, then as you say, it may be wiser to not anchor your elbow. If you have enough strength in your entire arm and shoulder to suspend your forearm in a place where your wrist is A)comfortably angled and B) you can get to the strings effectively, then you're golden.

Like rgalpin says practice the flutter first. on the steering wheel, edge of desk, whatever (sheesh, I did that too!). then figure out if you can anchor your elbow, because generally, that's easier to do. If you can't anchor, then suspend your arm. Don't give up - it takes time to build up the endurance. It's just like tapping eruption for the very first time ever - about halfway through your forearm says "WTF is up with all this movement? I'm tired!" flash forward a few months of practice and it's no big deal. play around with pick angles and hand angles. play around with whether upstroke or downstroke first works better for you. play around with starting the butterfly then applying to the strings, or whether you can just instantaneously turn it on as needed. video tape results and post here.

[rgalpin]

it took me a very long time to apply the motion to the strings - as soon as i got near the strings, it blew up - like there was an invisible force field - i am guessing it had to do with the positioning and the angle but it might have been a mental block. i gave myself a ganglion cyst that popped up out of the center of the top of my wrist from practicing it over and over. sick! but i did get it. i'll make a video to add to the collection.

[garbeaj]

A distinction has to be made between Eddie Van Halen's tremolo picking versus tremolo picking in general. Like I said before, for me and Bill and Troy Grady and many others, tremolo picking in general (not Eddie Van Halen's tremolo picking style) came naturally without much thought or effort.

I would recommend for people who are new to or struggling with tremolo picking to try whatever position and motion feels the best and yields the most consistent up and down, clear tremolo picking pattern. It may be a total exercise in futility to try and copy Ed's tremolo picking motion. He's the only guy I've ever seen doing that particular tremolo picking style and I wouldn't think that it necessarily works the best for everyone.

[garbeaj]

Troy's whole series is worth watching. Done on the level (or better) than the stuff on the Discovery Channel.

Amen. This is THE best instructional video out there...Entertaining and supremely groundbreaking and informative to such a specific degree on modern guitar technique.