I Think I Don't Like Humbuckers

jfhudak · Post by **jfhudak** » Sun May 18, 2008 8:37 pm

Hey Fellers,

I have had another tone revelation. . .I don't think I like humbuckers.

I have been playing around with my VOS 62 SG, and it sounds pretty damn good, but it doesn't move me. Something is missing. Enter my Les Paul Junior.

Holy cow. EVERY time I pick up my LP JR, I end up playing and really just enjoying the tones I get from that one P90. I feel the same way about my 52 RI Telecaster.

When I think about it, the only other guitar I have felt that way about was my 1991 Firebird V, and though they are humbuckers, they are indeed different than your garden variety PAF.

My two fav guitar players, Joe Walsh and Allen Collins, were also largely single coil guys. (Collins played a modified Firebird I with the bridge pickup moved to the neck position, and a dog eared P90 in the bridge). Pete Townsend seems to like single coils as well.

The ONLY humbucker guitar I have ever really liked was my 69 Les Paul Custom years ago, which had T-Tops in it. I am waiting on a set of T-Top clones from Lindy right now, so we'll see how they sound in the SG.

Anybody else out there just not like humbuckers? Maybe I just don't like PAFs? Maybe the even winds on the T-Tops sound better to me because they are more single coil like?

I don't know, but since re-examing my guitars, life has gotten much better tone wise!!!

All input, comments and suggestions are welcome! Y'all have never steered me wrong. . .

Peace

Johnny Reb

JD · Post by JD » Sun May 18, 2008 10:47 pm

Yes, it is very possible. I have a buddy that is a die hard Fender Strat/Tele single coil player. When he plays a humbuckered Gibson I think he sounds great but he just doesn't like the sound. He wants that single-coil bite and plays a relatively clean tone. FWIW, he's a very good and experienced guitarist.

I have suggested to others to wire their humbucker's coils internally in parallel (vs. standard series) which will retain the humbucking quality but sound more single-coil like, put in a coil cut switch (or push-pull pot), or swap out the humbuckers for the P-94 humbucker sized P-90. Or just get a P-90 equipped Gibson.

jfhudak · Post by **jfhudak** » Sun May 18, 2008 11:11 pm

JD wrote:Yes, it is very possible. I have a buddy that is a die hard Fender Strat/Tele single coil player. When he plays a humbuckered Gibson I think he sounds great but he just doesn't like the sound. He wants that single-coil bite and plays a relatively clean tone. FWIW, he's a very good and experienced guitarist.

I have suggested to others to wire their humbucker's coils internally in parallel (vs. standard series) which will retain the humbucking quality but sound more single-coil like, put in a coil cut switch (or push-pull pot), or swap out the humbuckers for the P-94 humbucker sized P-90. Or just get a P-90 equipped Gibson.

Thanks for your always excellent input JD!

Yeah, I just heard a buddy's SG Jr and again, it sounds like what I think a guitar ought to sound like through a Marshall. FWIW, I dig Hendrix, but only the live stuff where you can really hear those Strats thump through those Plexis.

I do like my SG, so I am hoping that the T-Top clones do the trick. I really want to make this guitar work because it's just so darn nice. However, I think it will be the last humbucker equipped guitar I'll buy.

Got my sights set on a Gretsch Duojet TDS. Course, there's also a VOS Les Paul Special at my local shop that I can make a deal on as well. Those guitars just sound killer to me. Love the weight, too!

Tell me, how do you wire humbucker coils in parallel? That sounds like an interesting experiment. I played a Dimarzio years ago that sounded VERY much like a single coil and it was advertised as such. Might this be what they did? I remember it sounded killer.

Again, thanks for your much-appreciated input!

Peace

Johnny

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Mon May 19, 2008 6:47 am

I kinda feel that way in a sense. Though I play more and enjoy the LP, when it comes to my sound or my music I just dont get all that excited with the humbucker tone. Its too nice I guess. Its just thick and chunky and quiet and Id even go so far as to say muddy and dull compared to single coils.

jfhudak · Post by **jfhudak** » Mon May 19, 2008 8:13 am

Billy Batz wrote:I kinda feel that way in a sense. Though I play more and enjoy the LP, when it comes to my sound or my music I just dont get all that excited with the humbucker tone. Its too nice I guess. Its just thick and chunky and quiet and Id even go so far as to say muddy and dull compared to single coils.

Word. "Dull" is a good way to describe it, but at the same time almost thin. I mean, that one little P90 in my LP Jr puts all other humbuckers I've ever tried to shame. Just no oompfh. Then again, it might be because Gibson Burstbuckers just suck ass. I have to admit, the 57 Classics in my last Les Paul sounded better. We'll see how the Fralins do.

My 11 year old son, who has great taste in music, just bought the first Aerosmith album. I hadn't heard it in years, but there's this song on there called "Movin' Out" and the Strat tone that Perry gets will send shivers down your spine!!!

Next guitar is either a Gretsch or a Strat for me.

Thanks for chiming in!! (no pun intended

)

Tone Slinger · Post by **Tone Slinger** » Mon May 19, 2008 11:01 am

I'd say its up to what your playing, as far as single vs. double coil pu's. There is a certain inherent 'pureness' to singles,sorta like things are more clearly 'magnified' into view, to use an analogy. Hb'ers, when matched to a particular guitar, get that great grit and width to the sound, along with more lower midrange and bottom. Whats strange is that I look for hb'ers that have alot of single coil charecter, and single coils with a little more hb'er type sound. I hope to strike this happy medium with the next guitar I build.

jfhudak · Post by **jfhudak** » Mon May 19, 2008 12:09 pm

Tone Slinger wrote:I'd say its up to what your playing, as far as single vs. double coil pu's. There is a certain inherent 'pureness' to singles,sorta like things are more clearly 'magnified' into view, to use an analogy. Hb'ers, when matched to a particular guitar, get that great grit and width to the sound, along with more lower midrange and bottom. Whats strange is that I look for hb'ers that have alot of single coil charecter, and single coils with a little more hb'er type sound. I hope to strike this happy medium with the next guitar I build.

Yeah, I hear you. I like the grunt and balls that a P90 has, or for that matter a Strat (set'em up right and you can honk like big dog). One thing that happens to me with humbuckers is they mush out on me. I plug in a P90 or even a Firebird pickup and they just punch real nice, but they don't get too distorted. And my Telecaster is the freaking bomb. You can do any of the James Gang stuff you want plus some Aerosmith ("No More No More") with a Telecaster.

My perception of the Burstbuckers, is that they have NO midrange to speak of. They are spikey and farty at the same time. They really are the worst sounding pickups I've ever heard. It's embarrassing how bad they sound.

Love the responses so far! This is the best forum on the net, as far as I am concerned!!!

Thanks, Fellers!

Johnny Reb

JD · Post by JD » Mon May 19, 2008 6:04 pm

jfhudak wrote:
JD wrote:Yes, it is very possible. I have a buddy that is a die hard Fender Strat/Tele single coil player. When he plays a humbuckered Gibson I think he sounds great but he just doesn't like the sound. He wants that single-coil bite and plays a relatively clean tone. FWIW, he's a very good and experienced guitarist.

I have suggested to others to wire their humbucker's coils internally in parallel (vs. standard series) which will retain the humbucking quality but sound more single-coil like, put in a coil cut switch (or push-pull pot), or swap out the humbuckers for the P-94 humbucker sized P-90. Or just get a P-90 equipped Gibson.
Thanks for your always excellent input JD!

Yeah, I just heard a buddy's SG Jr and again, it sounds like what I think a guitar ought to sound like through a Marshall. FWIW, I dig Hendrix, but only the live stuff where you can really hear those Strats thump through those Plexis.

I do like my SG, so I am hoping that the T-Top clones do the trick. I really want to make this guitar work because it's just so darn nice. However, I think it will be the last humbucker equipped guitar I'll buy.

Got my sights set on a Gretsch Duojet TDS. Course, there's also a VOS Les Paul Special at my local shop that I can make a deal on as well. Those guitars just sound killer to me. Love the weight, too!

Tell me, how do you wire humbucker coils in parallel? That sounds like an interesting experiment. I played a Dimarzio years ago that sounded VERY much like a single coil and it was advertised as such. Might this be what they did? I remember it sounded killer.

Again, thanks for your much-appreciated input!

Peace

Johnny

http://www.stewmac.com/freeinfo/Electro ... ibson.html

You can open up the pickup and still use your single-conductor, shielded lead. Per the attached link, the pickup bobbin leads corresponding to black and white are your ground and the ones corresponding to the green and red are your hot.

Roe · Post by **Roe** » Mon May 19, 2008 6:13 pm

filtertrons are great humbuckers

jfhudak · Post by **jfhudak** » Mon May 19, 2008 6:48 pm

Roe wrote:filtertrons are great humbuckers

Well, yeah, I have to agree with you there!!!

JB007 · Post by **JB007** » Mon May 19, 2008 10:07 pm

If you guys have humbucker LP's try the SD Phat Cat pickups. You get the P-90 sound in a standard humbucking space. Its one of my favorite pickups in one of my Gibson LPC guitars.

Roe · Post by **Roe** » Tue May 20, 2008 5:01 am

Tone Slinger wrote:I'd say its up to what your playing, as far as single vs. double coil pu's. There is a certain inherent 'pureness' to singles,sorta like things are more clearly 'magnified' into view, to use an analogy. Hb'ers, when matched to a particular guitar, get that great grit and width to the sound, along with more lower midrange and bottom. Whats strange is that I look for hb'ers that have alot of single coil charecter, and single coils with a little more hb'er type sound. I hope to strike this happy medium with the next guitar I build.

I recommend tvclassics, t tops, or paf type pups with a5 magnets, somewhat low output and assymmetrical winding

Tone Slinger · Post by **Tone Slinger** » Tue May 20, 2008 11:47 am

Yeh, I really like what I've heard of the Gibson T-top's. Were the ones made n the 60's-70's assymetrical ? I think I'm gonna get a High Order clone. Isnt the reading on these about 7 to 7.5 k ?

jfhudak · Post by **jfhudak** » Tue May 20, 2008 11:49 am

Roe wrote:
Tone Slinger wrote:I'd say its up to what your playing, as far as single vs. double coil pu's. There is a certain inherent 'pureness' to singles,sorta like things are more clearly 'magnified' into view, to use an analogy. Hb'ers, when matched to a particular guitar, get that great grit and width to the sound, along with more lower midrange and bottom. Whats strange is that I look for hb'ers that have alot of single coil charecter, and single coils with a little more hb'er type sound. I hope to strike this happy medium with the next guitar I build.
I recommend tvclassics, t tops, or paf type pups with a5 magnets, somewhat low output and assymmetrical winding

Cool, thanks for the input bro! What do the Alnico Vs do for you? I mean, I've heard of guys putting A Vs in Burstbuckers with pretty good results but I've never seen it described what the difference was.

Great responses to this thread! Keep'em coming!!!

Roe · Post by **Roe** » Wed May 21, 2008 8:33 am

Tone Slinger wrote:Yeh, I really like what I've heard of the Gibson T-top's. Were the ones made n the 60's-70's assymetrical ? I think I'm gonna get a High Order clone. Isnt the reading on these about 7 to 7.5 k ?

usually 7.25-7.75 and prettymuch symmetrical. but as high as 8k has been reported several times. I recommend weaker ones in the neck pos and stronger ones in the bridge pos.

these pups will only sound good in a good guitar IMO