MASS 150 is on its way!

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Thu Jun 30, 2005 1:23 pm

Well I just got paid and since I really need to replace my lost MASS for most of my amps and debugging the new amp I went ahead and got the 150W. Ill write a review soon comparing it to the normal MASS and the Hot Plate. I no longer own either but Ive owned them both at the same time for several years and am very familiar. BTW- I asked Weber about the wattage issue with the normal MASS. Yes Ive used mine to the extreme with my 100W Marshall heads in the past including my Super Bass with 550v on the plates. Never had a problem but Weber seems to not really get into the logistics. If you email him and ask him if the standard MASS is cool for your 100W Plexi he'd say its fine. If you email him and ask him if the MASS is cool with your 100W Plexi and specificaly say you think it puts out more then 100W (which they all do) he'll say its not good. Like I said I never had a problem with it but I want to be safe this time around plus the indivdual controls for attenuating high and low frequencies seems really interesting.

Flames1950 · Post by **Flames1950** » Thu Jun 30, 2005 2:47 pm

I'm very interested in hearing your thoughts on this thing when it arrives.
I'd have considered buying one by now, but the spec is that it is an 8 ohm device, but then claims it will work fine with 4, 8, or 16 ohms, which doesn't jive right with my brain, ya know?

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Jul 05, 2005 4:08 pm

Woooohoo..I have been contemplating this for a while ..Am REAL interested in what you hear ! I did the same thing and emailed Ted about the Mass 100 asking about the power rating and he said not a good idea to run a 100 full bore but may be ok at 6 ot 7. Hopefully the 150 works well . Also the two controls are interesting.

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Tue Jul 05, 2005 8:03 pm

Thats what sold me, those frequency controls. Im not worried about the 8ohms. Ive run my amps with small mismatches lots of times. Ive always used the 100MASS with my amp at full bore ecven as a load and it was fine. But I wont push it with another mass. Especially one of these more expensive, more elegant (hehehe) new ones. BTW- I just got the notification thart it should be here thursday.

gnugear · Post by **gnugear** » Wed Jul 06, 2005 10:41 pm

Cool, I can't wait to hear what you think. I originally had a Powerbrake, then switched to a Hotplate, then a 50 watt Mass, and lastly another Hotplate (since I switched to 100 watters). I liked the Mass a lot but thought it added a darker tone than the Hotplate.

rjgtr · Post by **rjgtr** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 10:11 am

They actually switch resistors in and out to get the different ohms.

RE: Hotplate vs Weber Mass - I own both and find the Mass is more organic overall and more natural feeling, but it does get dark at high attenuation levels. The Hotplate stays clearer at high attenuation levels. My take is that I prefer the Mass at lower attenuation settings. But I can see where a high gain or scooped voicing player would prefer the Hotplate. It seems to have more overall clarity at all levels.

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 11:55 am

I agree. The MASS is less buzzy and glassy at lower volumes. More natural. That darkness is a prime example of psychoacoustics. If you recorded the amp at no attenuation and extreme it wouldnt sound all that different. Flick on the treble comp and it may sound right live but on a recording it sounds like a tin can. Hopefuly this high and low atteanution control is a total solution as I hope it is. Its due today. If I get it in within the hour Ill give it a try. If not I wont be able to try it out until 7 tonight EST.

gnugear · Post by **gnugear** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 1:20 pm

I remember the MASS "feeling" better too ... like the speaker is actually making the unit respond differently. All this talk makes me want to try one again. I also like the looks ... very '50s.

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 1:28 pm

OK. Its here! And Ive had enough time to get a quick impression. I wont be able to really toy with it until tomorrow. I have to go back to work and I wont be home until 7 at which time the battle axe next door will be home. But my first impressions using it with a) 70/71 Super Bass, b) JTM100 1.5" clone, c) Custom Bandmaster Head, d) SLO-100 head, are

The Hi and Lo tone switches without a doubt ARE extremely useful. I was finally able to really get that sound I want were I can really dial in strait treble in the amp with only the bright channel on and treble and mids dimed with the bass on zero and presence up a ways. That sound is tight as all hell with harmonics that jump off the frets as well as a really complex low-medium crunch tone BUT it can be a bit too icepicky, especially with Strats and with a split V1 with a mixer cap. The Hi and Low knobs seem to me at this point to be set at really perfect frequencies to allow yuou to dial in an amp like that. What I did was first set the amp up, then bring the Lo knob to the desired volume level or just below that. Then bring the Hi knob up just enough so that the trebles are clear yet not enough to be shrill. Perfect. Its like a conjunctive filter but better. It is a great simple post output EQ. Live you just set the Hi a bit more for cut.

The amp I was really impressed with was the Soldano. I already knew my Marshalls sounded kick ass with the Old MASS but the SLO was always a touch too much bite. Now Im really lovin the bite with the Soldano. Dime the master and bring up the gain on the OD channel. Talk about a chunky smooth Marshallesque sound. Tight as fucking shit! and able to curb the shrillness.

It gets pretty hot but it seems to handle it fine. Im interested in tryin out the Line out next.

I need some more in depth time to see if my first impressions are deserved. All I know is Im totally lovin the Hi and Lo knobs and the tone is very earthy and natural just like my old MASS.

The lack of extra controls never bothered me with my old mass and they wont bother me now. The ONLY thing I can see as a con so far is how friggin robust this thing is. Its like a MASS but bigger.

More to come

PlexiMan · Post by **PlexiMan** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 2:38 pm

Wow...really close not to getting one now..i was REALLY curious about the two tone controls..I always wondered if they function like the bright and normal volumes on a Marshall when the channels are jumped..Dial in the right amount of low end or highs.
BB, any more info on how it functions ok with 4 or 16 ohms as well?

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 7:38 pm

I know its fine into 16 ohms but I dont know about a 4 ohms cab. Ive played with it for a little bit the last hour. I was reaching around behind it to togglr between the low and hi switch which is a couple dbs between them, when I accidentally hit the bypass switch and I got a ringing feedback for 5 seconds the whole row of houses probably heard. It was like friggin Red Rocks for a few seconds. Then I was tryin the SLO a bit more and I poped a fuse running it as a load. The SLO is weird. Even when loaded down you can really hear the signal buzzing out of the OT clearly. Moreso then any Marshall Ive ever played. You can actually play the damn amp with the output loaded just listening to the OT. Its probably not a good way to run an SLO and it poped a fuse. The 2 switches are very much like the 2 channels on a Marshall and you mix them in similarly. The difference is its not as much to do with the tone. What I mean is in a Marshall if you have too much of the normal channel the sound can flab out or get muddy as hell and similarly with too much bright channel by itself its makes things very tight but also very shrill. The tone knobs on the 150 are more stereo like. They dont really change the tone. They seem to make more of a difference as you get closer to stage volume. I cant really experiment after the noise I was just making but maybe tomorrow Ill have an in depth review ready.

PlexiMan · Post by **PlexiMan** » Fri Jul 08, 2005 8:55 am

LOL..still chuckling here..i wish i could have seen the faces

of the people when you hit the bypass switch. A maxed 100 watter is loud on stage but in a house it's insane..and believe me i experienced it..Well i'm glad to hear that so far the 150 seems to be pretty cool. Doesn't sound like you dislike it more than the standard Mass. Let us know when you get more playing time on how it compares to the Hot Plate?

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Fri Jul 08, 2005 9:29 am

Some people do. But in Philadelphia houses that are big and far enough apart from each other to do that cost a million. I have to wonder what that sounded like in the other houses. Lucky I didnt do it in my old apartmanet.

Billy Batz · Post by **Billy Batz** » Fri Jul 08, 2005 9:49 am

I really cant get a direct comparison. I sold my HP before I lost my MASS. I can reiterate old comparisons between the HP and MASS since I owned both for a long time. The 150 seems to be very similar or the same thing as my old MASS. Just with a hi and lo switch which makes it much better to me. The hotplate was always too fake sounding to me. Plastic sounding. Hard to explain. It was bright and glassy when it fell below -8dbs and had this very glassy brittle compression to it, like all attenuators have, but just more extreme. It seems that, like the Power Brake, it was probably dialed in with filters to try and make extreme attenuation sound more natural to the human ear which percieves sounds differently at different SPLs. I always thought the tone comp switches really make the HP (and probably the newer MASSes as well) sound really fake and horrible. They fake you out and some people like them but to me they sound horrible. I never used them. The MASS was dark but more organic. Im sure much of the compression that I didnt like had to do with a) hearing the amp on 10 at low volume, and b) the lack of speaker breakup to smooth the edges out. The MASS has it to to a degree but not like the HP. Maybe its the sound of a resistive load? Whatever it is I just didnt like the way the HP dealt with it or maybe added to it. The MASS is a bit muddy but more natural. The 150 seems the same but Im still loving the tone knobs.

Other people disagree. I always liked the MASS. I think the HP is a great ubit in a small package but I prefer the MASS. Some people like the PB and I absolutely hate it. Theyre all decent for taming stage volume though.

rgalpin · Post by **rgalpin** » Fri Jul 08, 2005 11:04 am

Dan,

Did you try the line out yet? I got the 150 about a month ago. I've been using it as a load - total attenuation and sending the lineout to a power amp. I'm using a '74 super lead - 100W dimed and have had no problems. It seems to sound sweeter the RedBox I was using to tap the speaker out and it provides a load which the RedBox doesn't.

I wonder if the 150 does anything that affects the tone of the line out. I don't know how it knocks the speaker signal down to line level but I assume that it uses a different technique or different quality components than the RedBox. With the RedBox, I had to run an EQ between it and the power amp (a Tech-21 Power Engine 300) to tame some high frequencies that were too brittle - and knock down some 400 that was too dense. With the 150 though, I can run straight into the power amp and it is sweet.

What is your experience with it?