Best listening for reference or just quality?

[Berlin]

I saw a thread before titled 'best reference for brown sound ' or something along those lines?- I don't know if this inquiry should of just been mentioned in that thread or not but a couple of years back I came upon this site:

http://www.hdtracks.com/van-halen-2015-remaster-225804

I get email offers from them still to this date. When getting one the other day I was prompted to look to see about thier VH catalog. I've never purchased anything from this site but have been intrigued by the notion of HOW MUCH better could the LPs sound in this format, say than the regular CD's or iTunes or Spotify. Growing up my older brothers were seeing them live in '79-'81 ish... I used to wear either ones tour shirts to school even though I was completely drapped in it- but they had all the original records. In Michigan where I grew up we'd go to harmony house and pick up a plethora of great records hot off the press!
I've heard some here make reference to the records as being the best and truest form of audio being on that type of medium. Then there is of course the above link I posted- and THENNNNN on eBay there's this:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/132066612456

A 24k gold CD- for $500. Whether that's just the price of Gold or not, I understand that this format is also a highly sought after medium... I remember seeing allot of 're-mastered' on gold discs as a better quality type thing... Never sound sampled or compared different formats like that before.

I guess all I'm asking is, what do most of the fine folks here use as an ultimate listening reference? How much more, nuances and such, will/can one benefit from listening from one format to another? How much better can an audio source be? I'm familiar with recording and different bits of quality from say a cassette version of an album to say a normal CD along with MP3 formats and all... but I've never put on a great set of audiophile cans or through a system, listened to no $500 24k Gold pressing or even that HDaudiotrack site. I suppose it also depends on what a remaster source is from? I just thought I would ask, if someone could say one way or another-" oh yes this (enter source) is night and day!! Hands down the best possible VH listening experience ever"... Type of statement. Even if it is an old 8track version perhaps-
Just interested in people's input*
Thanks-
Ps- sorry if this had been discussed already... Didn't really dig to deep in searching.

[awangotango]

an original press vinyl on a cheap 70's turntable with a $50 grado cartridge will get you a more accurate represetation of eds sound than a $500 cd

[Berlin]

That's kinda the school I'm from anyways-

[Megaro]

That is actually a really good question. I would also say vinyl but add the suggestion for a good pair of neutral headphones. Speakers add so much color to the source, which I think is one of the reasons that the Yamaha NS-10 was used on so many mixes. The first number of VH albums were mixed and mastered with vinyl in mind. But records require a good turntable and stylus, as you know, which gets into some real money if you go for reference quality. Digital is much easier. Personally, I take kind of a mix of CDs, the guitar ISOs on the internet, and then VH1 and Fair Warning that I have on vinyl. I don't know which is more accurate, they all sound some different. Sometimes Ed's guitar seems really bright on VH1 when I listen in my car, but then really mid-rangey when I listen on home stereo setup, and then too bass heavy when I listen in on some headphones.

A related question I always had is what kind of monitors were used at Sunset Sound when they were mixing. I assume they were built into the wall, commercial grade stuff. That is probably what Donn and Ted were listening to when deciding how the album should sound. But I think Ed and Al were doing their critical listening to the "records" in their car or what they heard coming out of the radio. In looking at photos from Sunset's webpage, they have those little Yamaha NS-10s seated right on top of the console, but I don't know if those monitors were around back then ??

[Berlin]

That's a good response as well!
I was in my car today- and in listening to pandora, DTNA came on and I listened to a couple of verses and then immediately switched from that to Spotify- so I could A/B as best as I could and I was kind of surprised- Spotify was actually sonically clearer, Ed's opening guitar riff was louder in the mix or something- it was just a 'better' listening experience than when it was played through pandora. I think, if I remember seeing clearly, that the one on Spotify, is a 2015 remaster? -

I also had a coupon in an email to use on any purchase on HDtracks - I purchased VH1... Have not as of yet downloaded it to my computer so I could put on my phone. But I'll update there as well for any who may or may not care about this little meaningless thought and experiment-

I also do own some nice pairs of headphones- a couple sets of ranging from decent to nice studio monitors also. I haven't done too much in the realm of hooking up all of these listening devices and then playing the different formats available... But after that little bit in the car today it might be worth doing for the fun of it! - I do have a couple of turntables (not currently set up) and also, all those original VH pressings on wax as well tucked away in some boxes- which is where they ended up after my basement flooded some time ago... But in that event those records were treated like WACF when making sure things survived the flood -

Also nice point about how Templeton and landee mixed for a record as well as what monitors were possibly used for that process? I went to a recording school in chilocothe Ohio where all thier studios were laced with many various listening
references... It was kind of an old school as well where they were using older beaters from back in the day for sound reference as well as installing the latest in modern digital (at the time 2004) speaks.
Any way... Now I'm just kinda rambling ~
I'll let this thread know about those HDtracks when I get it going here*

[Berlin]

Not that this thread is bursting at the seams with valuable information- - but went ahead and got those HDtracks downloaded onto my computer, into my iTunes. I then tried to load them onto my phone along with FW & WACF which were previously in my iTunes library already. The FW & WACF made it onto my phone-
the new HDtracks VH1, would not load onto my phone. I haven't read too much into the reason, all though it's there on thier site - maybe because of the quality or something- it's not compatible with ones internal phone audio listening source- ala iTunes on my iPhone or what have you.
As for those others being loaded onto my phone, I had purchased those on iTunes a couple or more years back. I turned on Romeo Delight from my iTunes... After a couple of bars, instantly played the same song via Spotify... And again Spotify's audio representation of the very same song was significantly louder- as well as clearer.
So far with all of this- I've been able to determine that at least in the 'digital' realm, Spotify seems to command performance over pandora and iTunes versions of the same song.

I plan on digging out my original LP pressings as well as listening to those HDtracks on my computer along with all the other various formats to see what kind of conclusion I can come to for what seems to be the best listening experience for quality and reference-
A silly experiment really- but what the hay... Since there doesn't seem to much else booming round these parts-

And with that- as quint from JAWS says...
Ovvvver ouuut

[garbeaj]

I don't know about this "HD Tracks" thing for download. It doesn't sound like a legitimate release from the band.

I do have the original DCC Compact Classics 24k Gold Disc Master Recording (the one you see on eBay for $500. I got mine new for $35 when it came out originally. It's the best sounding release of the first album that I've ever heard. I use it as a reference for transcribing the guitar parts and the tunings in my tuning thread along with the isolated Guitar Hero tracks.

I wish they would do official HD remasters...meaning I wish Eddie and Landee would be in on the remasters, probably along with Brian Kehew who did work on the recent remasters and other unreleased projects recently. I don't see any great, uncompressed FLAC or other High Definition Audio format releases from the band that would be an audiophile's treat for their Ponos player...

[Berlin]

Well I value your opinion and worth of knowledge Allen when it comes to all things -

The site is a legit site, as far as having rights to release all the titles the do- I believe it is more or less an 'audiophile' like site...

I stumbled upon it a couple years back when I was searching for some audiophile grade cans. It's the sample/bit rate of 192/24 that is making these "HD"...
Again- I had a coupon so I picked up VH1 - I'm going to run some listening tests- concerning all the mediums I have available- minus the 24k gold one... , but give a good aural test through various nice speaker set ups - just to see if I notice any great articulation between them*

That 24kG one you have Allen sounds like it'd be a nice listening experience if you give it that much praise-

I have the cassette, first LP pressing, CD, as well as all the digital stuff and now the HD ones-

Gonna do some serious brain melting!

[garbeaj]

Do you have a stereo system or a device that is capable of playing the maximum bitrate offered by the file you are trying to play. Obviously Neil Young's PonoPlayer and a growing list of devices. What are you using to play these files and do you know if what you have will play hi-res files?

[Megaro]

Hmmm. I recommend exercising some consumer skepticism when it comes to companies re-selling old material that they claim is now better through the wonders of technology. Especially when the term HD is used to market something that was recorded before downloading digital sound files from the internet even existed. Is it really better -- or just different ....

Take a look and see what you think:
http://www.metal-fi.com/hdtracks-everybody-wants-some/

[tWreCK]

Buy it and judge for yourself

[garbeaj]

Hmmm. I recommend exercising some consumer skepticism when it comes to companies re-selling old material that they claim is now better through the wonders of technology. Especially when the term HD is used to market something that was recorded before downloading digital sound files from the internet even existed. Is it really better -- or just different ....

Take a look and see what you think:
http://www.metal-fi.com/hdtracks-everybody-wants-some/

Excellent article and pretty much what I suspected. I don't have any equipment capable of playing back high-res files anyway so it's a moot point for me. I do have the original vinyl of all the Van Halen albums and the HDCD versions and the recent remasters (and I have the DCC Compact Classics Gold Master CD of Van Halen as I mentioned earlier) so I feel like I'm good.

[Berlin]

Nice article megaro!
Well someone essentially did the technical leg work on pretty much what I was posting about-
Allen, I think with what you have... That's really all one needs! I'm always searching, myself, for the best possible listening experience with any musical source that's worthy of being played in such a way. There will always be great listening devices... That 'audiophiles' will consider a "worthy" system... Usually units that seem to cost upwards to $1000 minimum-
And even though I've noticed clarity enhancements between various digital formats- I don't think anything that's deemed HD is or will be any more superior to a good ole first pressing LP- or possibly the 24k gold CD, which I'd still like to give ears to. I don't know how much clearer we could hear Ed's guitar presented better than it already has been I guess.

And kinda off topic- but I have really been hard pressed to find a better live representation of Ed's prime VH1 tone and just perfectly captured live recording of the band than- the nightmare before Halloween-
If there are any others of that quality or better, I would love to know about em. That recording is so amazing in my opinion- even though that's old hat to everyone round these parts im sure.

[awangotango]

regarding headphones, i'd recommend the inexpensive 'soundmagic e'30, the e50's or the e80's They are iems (in ear monitor style) and approx $40-60. Very natural and neutral sound (apart from a tasteful bass boost on the e30/50).

[Berlin]

Thank-you for the ear phone recommendation! I haven't heard of those- did some looking into em though! Solid! I was never into the in ears... Then for lack of sound system in my old car, I was wearing the iPhone ear buds more than I would of wanted to, and my ears just kinda got used to 'in ears'...
I love a nice set of ear goggles- but I can't seem to find a pair where I'm not suffering from ear fatigue and pain- jaw/lobes
+ headphones are like toothpaste... So many options and one can only discern so much from reading reviews online... And a place like best buy has only certain model options as well.
I'm going to look into the soundmagics though*~